Book Club

Jun 2nd, 2016 10:59 PM

Glancing up at Nell, offering her a reassuring smile as she excuses herself, David opens his hands to take the books she offers. “I'll be sure to get them back to you,” the Master tells the Apprentice. Out of any of the Kindred gathered, David knows how much this must kill the Magician; having to leave before her bottomless curiosity is sated.

Feeling Katya's eyes on him, David turns more squarely towards her and nods appreciatively at her explanation. “It makes one wonder, doesn't it. If the Night is so strongly associated with the Underworld, is the Underworld itself the Night? I wonder if the Kindred of the time saw themselves as the Ammit.”

Each night, the Sun God himself stands before Osiris' benign judgment. What sins would the Sun confess to?

“Even Khonsu, the God of the Moon, is usually depicted as mummified. An interesting thing to think about. I think I mentioned this,” David adds after a moment, “but I believe this is where the idiom of 'a heavy heart' originates, at least in meme form. Though in our more modern incarnation, 'heavy' is more grief than it is sin.”

There's a lot to take in, David knows. The Egyptian Pantheon moved and shifted like sand-dunes, dancing along the tides of both social mores and politics. It made some Gods come and go, merge with others or split apart all together. The Libitinarius applauds the solid grasp Katya gained in the short time she had. It took him far, far longer.

**David Silver** · Jun 3rd, 2016 08:26 PM

"I am glad to hear, Vivian, that you are learning something tonight. I too am enjoying myself, learning about aspects of the Egyptians I had not considered. Though to make things even more interesting, and tying in with your knowledge of the greeks, are you familiar with Zeus Amon? The Romans were not the first to appropriate the gods of others, though they were by far the most famous. Indeed, the Greeks hellenized and adopted Amon, and merged him with their concept of Zeues. Which was fine with the Egyptians, to them merging and movement of gods was part of life."
David listens closely as katya and Regan discuss the passage of the soul, and the vampire's place in it. A good philosophical discussion springs forth, and David cannot help but follow his own mind and thoughts as they take and carry the discussion further,

"It does make one wonder. To carry the allegory fruther, I offer this hypothesis. Instead of Ammit, I think of the kindred might instead be the demons guarding the gates. After all, our power rests in our names. Daeva, Gangrel, Ventrue, Mekhet, Nosferatu. Each clan has its own strengths and weaknesses, and in the old tradition, to name something was to have power over it. Not just mystical, but true power. To know what you are facing, and thus know its weaknesses. Especially as the number of gates was always questionable, perhaps so too the number of clans and bloodlines is questionable as well. What do you think Katya?"
To hear David speak of the Night and the underworld so closely, perhaps Katya was a good liason between them.

Jun 5th, 2016 12:44 PM

Katya's eyes wander as she plays with David's suggestion in her head. It would certainly make sense, they could never see the sunlight again and if night was their only other time to move throughout the realm, was that not indicative of the Underworld given their own undead states?

Then the other David hits something that Katya aligns with more closely, that of gateways. It did stand out to her the most that there were gates people passed through to get to final judgment. She just wasn't sure if the process would take twelve hours for Kindred, that would be like seconds.

"Being that we cannot see daylight again, I could see the Night acting as the Underworld, being that we all had to make our descent into unlife before reaching that state. Silver's thoughts do make me wonder, are we guarding the gateways for others to pass through or are we navigating through each night finding a new gateway ourselves? I think it can be both, each new clan, bloodline or Covenant member we meet offering a new challenge for us to take in, whether that be in a friendly way or purely antagonistic." In this context, her demons could be considered Brady, Rhayna, perhaps even Martha. "What remains is of course the 'heavy heart' as David brought up. What sins or grief do we weigh against a feather? Are they the same as kine or do sins and grief have different meaning once we have died the first time?"

We have six days left until the month mark

Jun 5th, 2016 06:31 PM

There were things that David mentioned about the Moon God being mummified that made sense. “For not knowing much about the history nor an in-depth look at the gods themselves, David, I’d venture to say that they the God may represent us ‘creatures of the night’."

Chuckling to the other David’s comment. “Silver, unfortunately my time over the years has only been allotted to what’s in Hollywood such as Clash of the Titan’s, Jason and the Argonauts, and those sorts of movies. Although, Hollywood has substantially increased their depictions of the Greek gods over the years, far more than the past. But alas, that is all I’ve been exposed to in that realm. Some Egyptian as well, but Hollywood doesn’t equal history.”

But Katya’s question was as heavy as the subject manner. “That is a very interesting thought. My personal thoughts are that some would think this is a second chance. We are sometimes able to create a different persona and begin again in different parts of the world with enough time to do it.” Well, that is if they were allowed. “I’ve begun myself, so, I would think that depending on your mentality, yes, they weigh more as we’ve learned to see the mistakes of Kine and ourselves.”

Jun 5th, 2016 09:26 PM

“M'kh't,” David says softly in response to Silver's hypothesis. Names and naming something gives it power, a belief that is older than the Abrahamic Religions. The Libitinarius' accent when he says his own clan name carries a note of the exotic. Unlike how time and Western lips have re-created, molded, and changed the pronunciation. In Egyptian, the word means 'balance.' It suggests the Shadows are caught between the living and the dead; between light and dark; neither going one way or the other.

'Balance' might be a charitable word.

Faintly nodding at Katya's response and then Vivian's, David offers, “Every night brings with it new experiences, new challenges. We are not islands and we are not made of stone. We change and each time we meet someone new, experience something new, we Change.” A year ago, David was in a very different place than he is now and that is because of Ava and everything she's given him.

“Tonight has given me something new to mull over and Change again because of it. Was there anything else we wanted to talk about tonight?”

**David Silver** · Jun 6th, 2016 08:15 PM

"An excellent question Katya. What sins or grief do those of us who have survived for sometimes centuries accumulate? Perhaps it would be easier to say what we do not. And that is ignoring what the Deep Sleep does to us, to strip our minds of our memories of deeds, good or ill. Can we be held accountable for something that we forget?
Sadly knowing the judgement of Osiris, I suspect we would be weighted quite harshly on the scales. As for our grief, I know that personally I carry much of it with me, even after all these years. Even more is added over time, as we become distant from those kine that we once associated with, their deaths coming like passing leaves." David says with a slightly depressive sound. If the scales of Duad await them, he knows that he will be unhappy with the result.
"Indeed Vivian, the butchers of southern california make short work of all that they touch. I have not seen those films, but I know of their interest in truth and accuracy. I would be tempted to see their new examination of Exodus some time, if only to verbally rip it apart. " He says with a laugh.
"Though you raise an excellent point. Many see this existance as a chance to attempt again what was denied in life. To have new powers and meet new people and discover new truths of the world. It is almost romantic, were it not for the downsides that come with it. " The beast stirs within David's mind, almost as if it was called, and he focuses on pushing it back down. "But it is an opportunity to continue. To progress where the human life stopped and find new purpose . The new truths and new possiblities give us great leeway to proceed how we wish."

Silver does not hear the Priscus' muttered word, but he does hear his question. "I had nothing further to discuss, but I did want to extend you both an invitation to return here in a few weeks time for the Summer Solstice. I hope you both will be able to come."

Jun 7th, 2016 07:49 PM

Both David's offer a neutral if not negative sense of their existence and how it parallels with Duat. Katya wouldn't want it any other way, she knows there is no path to paradise after this. THey are deep within Duat and if there is anywhere else, there is only a deeper descent down into some other realm, perhaps that is what differs their kind from mortals in that if the heart is too heavy, it drags them down further into a darker abyss.

"Indeed, there is much for me to consider as well, but I was glad the book club gave me the opportunity to explore thsi further. There are many elements of Duat that I quite liked." She says to the group. "to bounce off of Vivian's idea, I think that our past personalities and deeds are like echoes, faint traces that I admittedly am unsure how much they affect our cognitions as we struggle with our unconscious monsters inside of us. They do act as a useful guide through Duat, at least until we run into new gates and Demons.' to this she grins at them all briefly before letting it fade. "I think the weight of our hearts does make us sink, perhaps deeper into a new layer of the Underworld, and maybe that's where my interpretation of it shifts from Egypts' but I agree, for good or for ill, it does signify that our first deaths lead to change and not stagnation."

Her eyes close for a moment as she rests on those thoughts before opening them again and saying "I also have nothing else to add, but I do hope to see you both at the Summer Solstice. Thank you also for agreeing to this evening, it was quite enlightening."

I have nothing else to add really if folks are good to close

Jun 7th, 2016 08:36 PM

I'm good too, thank you so much for the scene!

Jun 9th, 2016 10:36 AM

Also gtg, we should do this again soon!

Book Club

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