Making the time to listen and talk

[Chambers]

True enough. "But for that you need total awareness and knowledge of every factor involved and unfortunely such hefty precaution come with costs." A few moments are taken to think of an example, one it might be the topic of the soul that brought to this one in particular. "We can reduce the risk of paradox down to nothing with the creation of a demesne but to do so requires ripping out part of your soul." A risky thing to do in its own right and not mention the dangers to the soul stone itself. "There is always a price to be paid we just have to ask what we are willing to pay." The Mysterium had the right of it there, nothing came free. "But that is a grand thing and I personally advocate for paying more attention to smaller scale endeavours that might not be much alone but build up." A slow and steady process, not grand or flashy but much more stable.

They all had mentors and likely none of them perfect. "The one who took me in when I awoke had equal distain for the pentacle and seers both. We have been estranged since I joined the Mysterium." And that troubled him clearly but here he was.

At the idea of lens Chambers opens the box of wood and brass at his feet revealing jars of heavy glass filled with powders, sticks of chalk and wool. One of the small central draws is opened and a watchmaker loupe removed. "Something like this? The lens is made of diamond try looking through it with your sight active."

Looking through a diamond gives +3 to scrutiny rolls to study resonance

As for the next. "Do you mean supress? If so having no aura is as noticeable as having a mages aura." Everyone had an aura so being conspicuous by absence was just as bad. "Studies into prime would help you a great deal I think." That arcana had a better tool for the job of hiding. "The greatest edge we have is caution." No amount of tools could replace that. "Care and consideration." Mastering the self and keeping the ego in check. "This will sound harsh but do you think any number of tools could have saved Corn? Or would they have made him worse?" When people thought they were safe is when they got complacent. Now if this had been a group setting the slip could well have gone unnoticed but one to one it is caught. "Thaumium glows when charged with the mana it needs to counter spell. A ring no matter how romantic would be more of a beacon then protection." Unless he had had read this wrong and Guru actually wanted to doom someone but that didn't seem like the Sharman who was talking of not wanting to lose anymore.

His own curiosity tickled as Guru offers an example and the question becomes is it an example and nothing more? But with restraint the question is buried. "Knowledge of a verge and its conditions are indeed very difficult to weigh and I ma not skilled enough to say. There's a reason I'm not curator." Easy in theory devilishly hard in practice. "I try to practice it yes, otherwise it won't become habit and I won't improve. At the point I am required to lean more Guanxi then I would like but that is what it is." Both debts owed and debts in his favour.

A nod in agreement. "Yes ideals are hard to live up to, unrelenting with all the pressure on us to do it. But what is worth doing that was every easy?" Shadow names were interesting and not for the first time the insight explains a few things. "Curious. As for mine well I didn't choose it I was given it." Far from unheard of for mentors to give their newly awakened charges a shadow name. "I met a few who claimed the title guru while in India, they were a mixed bag of individuals for sure." A few had been very questionable. "It is hard to put a finger on what made the good ones good but a few exuded something that set them apart from the rest." Curious to see if the mage who turned the title into a name knew what he meant.

A slight tilt of the head. "We are still talking but think of it less like a pass or fail, its not a test in that way more like a journey." A pause to carefully word the next answer. "The next steps will be for me to cast a divination to determine what you need to do to progress in the order and once you have fulfilled that you will under go a ritual to advance to where I am now." As for improving. "Try to incorporate the Mysterium's ideology into your practice." How to put this into a useful analogy. "This is not a good one but the best I can do in the moment. In a university the new teaching assistant isn't immediately promoted to department head or in a religious organisation a lay person isn't given the office of spiritual leader immediately. What is it that these individuals must do to advance?" Yeah that had room to go in the wrong direction. "Be worried, You and I? What reason would we have to be worried?" Having missed the wider question for lack on context.

Oh the medieval scholar had an ego for sure. "If you believed you had seen angels as a young man while being surrounded by the pressure of the church at the time would you have turned out differently?" The question carries a hint of the Moros mirth even as he adds the context. "But the gnostic gospels are still around and can still be read." They just lacked the mainstream attention. "A good question to ask is why where they buried?" What was the church trying to hide by doing so. Followed by a chuckle. "Now on religious teaching I think the Buddha might disagree with you about suffering being a must." The dharmic religions were much more interesting then the Abrahamic when it came to closeness to the truth and breaking down assumed requirements.

As for the sewer plant. "Just be careful the mages that got in trouble there were powerful, skilled or both from what I understand." So whatever had bested them was unlikely to be a push over. "Reconnaissance over immediate solutions unless there really is no alternatives." None of it sat easy, not one of the problems that had reared or how they were having to divide their forces to try and conquer them all. "Oh, yes having a guardian in the sanctum is a smart move." The assumption that sleepers didn't frequent a mages sanctum was unsaid.

[Guru]

Chamber's point was poignant and clear on the matter, the Shaman nodding along his understanding as he commented. "I've always seen the creation of a demesne as a great sacrifice." And why they're exceedingly rare. "Building a stable foundation and starting on a smaller scale let's you more safely and manageably start to change the scale while managing the risk." It sounded rote the way he said it, because it had been, it was something he'd been told and something he told others in turn. It was the basis of that long ago dream turned nightmare. No nothing is free, we don't always see the cost until after. The topic of mentors was a shared pain between the two which created an awkward tension for the shaman as he clearly wanted to do something to -fix- the problem. Maybe it was Wisdom or precaution but he let that one lay for now.


Guru's eyes went down to the box, it had glanced there more than a time or two already but he didn't want to talk about the elephant in the room. So his eyes lit up with visible excitement as the contents inside were finally revealed. Guru gingerly took the watchmaker's loupe and placed it into his left eye and brought a hand up to study since it would be comparing like to like to see how fine a detail it could get into. "Something similar, yes. Though I'd make it so you can swap out the lenses for each resonance type. It'd be something others can add and build onto. We all need different ways to see things." He offered with a smile as he slid the loupe out of his eye and handed it back to Chambers.


"No, not suppress because like you said...no, just make us appear asleep like everyone else." Caution, Care, Consideration we could call them the three C's, "And the only way to engrain caution, care, and consideration is through rote and ritual." He continued the rest of the thought out loud knowing it was hard to ask people to go slow. Knowing from well lived, personal, and heavily biased experience. And the question about Corn hit him in the chest like a load of bricks, he could feel himself pull in and tense up again. He shook his head at the question though, the reply soft. "No, what he needed was care and a quicker intervention. I pushed my skepticism of the ordeal onto him, I didn't think it was a good idea but he was still happy...until he wasn't. A story I've seen repeated in a thousand different forms."


He took in a deep breath and shook his head, "I think it's about finding a balance, within reason, or knowing and accepting the risks that come with it. I don't think he could do the latter which is why he ended up the way he is." By the end of the statement his eyes were off in the middle distance, his voice robotic and cold as he had to take a moment to come out of it and shake off the still fresh grief. The information about Thaumium almost instantly pulled him from that state, his eyes blinking as he processed that. "Certainly we could encase it in a noble metal to hide that without diminishing the effect?" It was a question because he his knowledge was all theoretical at this point and unfortunately his rudimentary knowledge of Prime was displaying itself.


A smile as they shared that curiosity together but he had to accept that he may never be worthy for such a seat. He was going to have to work on integrating that into his daily life as he was free and loose with his information regarding the lie as he had previously regarded it as not mattering in comparison to the truth. "Think I need to work on that too, have a lot I feel I owe at the moment." A nod of solemn acknowledgement though the fact they were both working on their Guanxi now brought a smile of amusement that tugged at the shamans lips. "Oh that's an understatement." He added with a laugh on the topic of Guru's being a mixed bag. Though when asked about what made the good ones good that shadow return to cast over him. Though it hung in his posture, an invisible weight on those shoulders he gave a small nod. "Some get closer to the Truth then the others. They just need to make that next realization and have their eyes opened for good."




The real question behind the fear he had wanted to ask was if he was acceptable, if he was going to be let go, discarded. But the fact that he was willing to cast the divination was a positive indicator to Guru, that was the pass condition to himself. It had been a long time since the Shaman had cared about what anyone else thought of him and it was an uncomfortable but necessary position. A nod when he said to add the Mysterium ideals into his everyday life, he needed to make it part of rote, habit, and identity. It was not going to be the easiest journey for the affable shaman. The analogy Chamber's tried to make was lost on the shaman as he scrunched up his face in thought. "I mean, in any organization you generally put the time in. Learn the role you have so you can teach it to the next person and then you fill in all the way up. Ideally you organize with redundancies in place. Hello, hi, it's us, we are the redundancies." He added with a small laugh at the dark joke.


He grew somber when asked about the worries, "San Francisco, the treatment plant, Corn, Philip. It just feels like something is on the wind, but I'm not Acanthus and this is pure conjecture." He shrugged knowing it didn't make any sense that it wasn't anything but instinct he had to go on. Though at the question on if he would be different he couldn't help but laugh loudly and nod. At its core it was the difference between and Obrimos and a Shaman. "Yes! You've seen my first reaction to authority of any kind. Like touching a hot stove. I am wary of power and the structures that hold it, of course I would have been different." The question as to why they were buried were the point Guru was trying to get to, the young mage unknowingly using the socratic method in most of his questioning. "Exactly! Could you imagine if that was the prevailing doctrine now? Just how much we could have saved? How better off we might be? Or it could have been suppressed for a reason, a finger put on the scale from opening up Pandora's Box." He was not privy to those secrets and how could one weigh reality saved? "Would they disagree though? On calling it suffering maybe, if I changed the terminology to difficult or challenging I don't know they would."


He gave a small, two fingered salute at the direction for the water plant. "That's my plan, but I want to get as much intel as possible as discreetly as possible. From my initial research I don't know if it's something just the two of us could handle either way. Go in and come back with a better plan of attack since the first team is out of contact. From what I know already it's not good and it's only going to get worse. I have a way for us to get in discreetly, see more of what's around without raising too much question. Getting into the "inner sanctum" is going to be the hard part and where I'm likely to fail. If I need to abort I can shapeshift out. I'll see what kind of potion I need to make." He knew he wasn't bound to a form of flesh and blood if he didn't wish to be but the levels of effort and preparation varied when a simple rat would do to blend in and escape. "They say you shouldn't plan to fail but anyone who follows that hasn't ever faced real failure before."

[Chambers]

Sacrifice was one way to put it, trade was another limited potential to safely practice powerful magics drawing the gap between maximum potential and achievable potential closer from both directions. "Some might view it as such yes, others are all to eager to rip their soul into pieces." And what more proof was needed that magic was of the soul when even a piece of it could be put to such a mighty endeavour as totally crushing the lie albeit in a limited space. "And then Guru would you do if the a task fell before you that was so great that even to start small was a greater endeavour then you had ever considered undertaking? When each of the bricks needed to set a foundation is a separate hurdle beyond any challenge you have yet to face?" Great works could be made of lesser but the scale was different lesser on such a scale didn't mean easy or safe.

Taking the loupe back it safely stored in its cushioned draw, the box however remains open there was a good chance the contents would be needed again before they were done. "You speak of an imbued item or set of items then each lens imbued with a separate Arcanum's sight." Such ideas were fanciful but had one overwhelming flaw that none yet had manged to over come. "Such a thing would push a mages contagion to it's limits, unless you knew what lens you needed ahead of time but then why would you need the device?" If Guru had the idea maybe he had succeeded where none had managed before and found a solution to the problem.

The ability to transform aura for extended durations would if the Moros knew his arcana. which he did, require a disciple of prime to imbue the item. "Our aura gives us away to those who know yes, much as the reverse is true. use of supernal sight or scrutiny can be very useful in learning these things and no measure is completely safe." High potency sight beating out lower potency attempts to hide. "But such things are possible so I ask you, why are they not mass produced already?" It was another idea that was far from knew which means it had a flaw of its own.

Honestly as for his deceased path mate. "I don't know what Corn needed, from what I understand many mages warned him of the danger impressed on him what would happen if he continued." But something be it ego or hubris or pride or something else had resulted in every warning falling death. "His tale is one we have all heard many times of mages he could, would only learn through the experience and one they normally don't survive." Not many mages die of old age that was certain.

The eyebrows of The Moros rise a little. "I had not considered encasing it in another material." Guru well and truly had him here, the idea was totally new to the Moros. "I have no idea what that might do or affect. You would have to experiment." His knowledge of perfected metals was as purely thermotical as the Sharman's and rather lacking in anything more then the basics.

Guanxi existed to allow for the trade of information in a hierarchal system without totally disadvantaging those lower on the rungs. "It is no shame to owe Guanxi, in a way it makes me look for opportunities to pay it back." And hadn't that lead to an interesting commitment recently. "I know Aurora is interested in recovering what was taken from this place." Gesturing to the empty room around them. "And I am on the cusp of having a way to find it. Is that something that would interest you to help with?" The first offer of a tangible task. The talk of some Gurus being closer then others gets a appreciative nod the same is true of most sleepers.

The brazen joke gets a small chuckle from Chambers along side Gurus own. "Redundancy is one thing we don't have with only three members of the order and as of the moment only I having passed the first real test we barely qualify as being worthy of notice." In most Athenaea Chambers would be on par with the janitor or in the role himself. "But that is no excuse to rush things ahead of when they should be." And before to terribly long he hoped both Aurora and Guru would apricate why. "But yes time, loyalty, commitment and tradition are all valuable things to a company, a religious group and to the Mysterium." They could accurately be described as a mystery cult after all.

The currently list of problems is laid out to bare and he takes a gentle sigh. "Out of perspective yes it seems like alot but we have a city's worth of problems and far from a cities worth of mages to handle them." Between councillors, provosts, sentinels, heralds and a hierarch a full Consilia had around twenty official positions going spare and anywhere from double to five times the number of affiliated pentacle mages and apostates in the general population. Sacramento was a rare rare exception. A true outlier. "It does not help that some of the problems are brought on by the very few mages we do have." Or that some of those mages barely seem to exist. "Yes we have problems. But we can are are solving those." He and Cavendish had the San Fran situation well in hand. "Knowledge is power and between Skye's report and Cavendish's additions San Fran are not as strongly positioned as would first appear." Which also brought him to a good point. "Both Skye and Cavendish mentioned you might have been present for the acclaimed murder of one of our own in front of other supernaturals?" Sacramento clearly had a history of problematic mages.

Now a touch unsure how much that was being applied to the long dead saint or the recent changes in the Consilium. "I am aware not everyone likes authority and it has been and still is heavily abused." No such thing as a system free from the possibility of abuse. "I'm honestly surprised Councillor Salem agreed me needed a hierarch." But it had saved him a battle so certainly not complaining. "But leadership and structures do have advantages when used properly, its why I stepped down as councillor of the Moros, so I wouldn't be advising myself." Under the charter that he himself had written giving up the seat had not been required. "And why I've been giving lessons of the lex, make it less scary for people." Harder to abuse a system that others understand.

But as for dharmic teachings. "Yes I think they would disagree, the teaching of Buddhism resolve around removing suffering from your life the how and why have become a little more complex as different traditions arise but generally a sign of success is the enlightened state they strive for." A good deal of the stories might be hagiography or have truth to them but even so the sheer degree of common sense at the core of it was astounding.

Now hidden doctrines and suppressed knowledge that was a conversation to get stuck into. "How much do you know of the Mysterium's teaching on pancryptia?" It had been on the check list of topics to clear up if needed and this was a good a way to introduce it as he was likely to get.

The connections that is what worried him the most. "Good I'm glad someone else understands that sometimes leaving is the best option to come back better prepared." The rush in one and done reckless mentality often lead to far to many unnecessary risks. "Would you mind sharing what you do know so far, of all of the problems this one has be the most concerned." So many unknowns. Why where they there at all? What went so wrong? "A master of matter can make holes in any material, but Corn still managed to get arrested." The lesson hopefully clear, having options to escape might not always be enough.

[Guru]

Shaking his head in disbelief still finding it hard to believe you'd find so many willing and eager to tear up pieces of their soul. It just felt like such a violation to him, so taboo that it wasn't even a consideration. And then his follow up was like getting hit by a truck, he could feel the color begin to drain from his face, a light sheen of sweat started to form on his brow as he literally stepped into the situation Chambers described. "I would try not to crumble, first. Step one, take a deep breath and then think about the problem. Start breaking it down, simplify, sub-divide," he was racing now as his eyes weren't focused on Chambers anymore. "if necessary I would reach out to experts. The task might be difficult, it might be daunting, but I doubt it's impossible." He was certain of himself by the end of it, or he had at least convinced himself. "I would coach Patience because any great undertaking is going to take, well, a lot of time."




"Had a dream of one, like what I've used in a lab." He could still hear the flashes of color the lenses made from that dream. The contagion was a problem he had chewed over and wondering if severing the personal connection was enough or if he could make it fuel dependent to create yet a further separation. He wasn't sure but he'd just learned a lot of new things and was clearly quite excited by it. "Would mostly use it to study other items primarily I imagine, I was mostly thinking of the cursed item and then trying to expand upon it instead of sticking to the original idea." He answered honestly, scratching the back of his neck in a little bit of embarrassment as he'd grown slightly red in the face.


The shaman nodded knowing what Chambers said to be exactly true. There was no such thing as perfect security. He was still on the fence of whether safety itself was an illusion. "Yes that's true enough. I'd still rather be protected than not though." Then the next question and the Shaman thought again, this one took him some time. "Disbelief I imagine - the abyss slowly eroding away any spec of truth under its gaze." Some venom there but he was speaking of the abyss. "So I imagine, like most things its deemed the cost isn't worth the benefit. That might be true and I'll likely come to the same conclusion when I really take the time to dissect it properly. But...I'm also a little paranoid, so maybe not." There was an amused smirk on his face as he let out a little laugh at that.


"Who doesn't want to fall in Love? I get it, but I also understand the risks which is why I live alone." He offered a dismissive shrug that he himself only half believed. The need for companionship was a hard draw to ignore. Then the topic of experimentation had the shaman smile from ear to, eyes sparkling with wonder as any new unknown drew him in like moth to flame.


"Not shame, just a personal habit to keep a clean slate. Though I understand there is value in the debt as well as it can be seen as an investment." It was an uncomfortable position for him, he'd been in someone's pocket before and it took work for him to separate the two instances from the other. Though as he brought up filling the room he took a look at it, took a real look at it, mostly out of curiosity because he already had the answer. "Of course - I'd very much love to help. Let me know when and where or should I go talk to her?" A brow raised, mostly because he wanted to know who to report to, who was lead.


"No, not a lot of redundancy to go around across the board." Chambers caught the Shaman before the thought could even begin to form, coaching patience and timing where the Shaman loved to rush. He nodded, agreeing and accepting that fate. "Have to follow the process, right?" A bitter medicine but it was one the shaman had needed. "Commitment can be tested and proven but nothing replaces time." He answered his own internal question out loud as he thought through what chambers had said. Then his worries were addressed in short order, the first point still hung like Damocles' sword over them. How do you handle a cities worth of problems without a cities worth of mages? Then that feeling from earlier crept back in under his skin. "I'd say that's a no more than usual at least."


Cold turned to frozen as his heard began to pound heavy in his chest. Hands clenching into fists as he brings up that night again. He didn't want to talk about it, he wanted to forget that night had ever happened. You don't mean that. That familiar grounding voice of his mentor helping to push the fear that had rose up down but he still seemed on the edge of having a panic attack. "I had other problems that night. There was...a monster. A real monster. I don't remember much other than what I'm feeling right now after that." His voice growing a few octaves as the discomfort squeezed at him. "I had to talk to an old friend to have him confirm what happened. He, uh, really went out of his way that night. It was the first step that led me here. He proved I could trust him because I wasn't anything but a stranger to him then." Moving away from the point of fear and to more comfortable grounds had the shamans body start to untense.




"Structure and Organization help provide for longevity and stability. I've just seen it abused more than utilized properly. I might take you up on one of those lessons one day but I'd think I'd have to gag myself to not argue." The laugh that came was a high pitched, tittering thing as he was still calming down from brushing against that trauma kept locked away tight in his mind. When corrected he shook his head, "You're right I accidentally dove to deep and hit Nihilism, different kind of ego death. As far as Pancryptica goes, that's separating Truth from Lie. To be simple - but it's trying to find out the big picture, the whole truth. Like trying to catch messages from a distant buoy?" He wasn't sure he liked the metaphor, he knew he could do better. "Like in folk tales." He offered a nod, it was not his field of expertise but there was more than enough research for him to dissect for much the same.


"I try to be as prepared as I can be and given the recent history, extra careful." Chamber's last point has made him pause, take a second, and put that thought to the side so he could answer the first question. "Looks like rats are bursting out of people's throats spontaneously. Was a couple awhile a go, months apart. Apparently most of the dead were found in admin and seemed to be victims of such. Some conflicting reports on the timing of what happened though it seems like they were caught out twice? I think it might tie back to another incident Pheonyx and I worked a few months back. Water based, disease, can't rule it out. I'm not relying on an escape but I don't want to have to panic and wonder what my plan is because I will panic if shit hits the fan and I don't have a plan."

[Chambers]

The shaman reacted to threads of the conversation quite apparently it was not to hard to tell what each thing made him feel but the draining of colour was unexpected. "Are you feeling alright?" They were only speaking hypothetically after all. "And yes I agree patience is key, so many seek to solve problems immediately and in one go, a hunt for immediate gratification." And that was a trap nothing made to last, nothing made well was put together in a few easy moments.

Yes different mage sights releveled different things and made different resonance easier to understand however if a cursed item was what he wanted to examine. "Prime would be your best bet for understanding magical items cursed or otherwise." Although his curiosity was peaked, yet has to be reigned in, this was a good opportunity to check another element of the orders principles. "If the item in question is a supernal artefact I don't have sufficient standing to offer you assistance, if its a weaker imbued item I might be able to." The offer was genuine but mixed in wit ha statement that might confuse or displease those who didn't grasp the Mysterium's way of handling knowledge.

A incline of his head concedes that yes being protected is better then not. "The reason is two fold, firstly contagion most mages can't have all the spells they want active in their pattern without it interfering with their spell casting, some are not strong enough to tolerate enough spells regardless of their contagion." In a perfect world they could all have as many protective spells in their patterns as they like but that was not the case. "Secondly creating an imbued item like that either count against the casters spell tolerance which s far from limitless or requires a substantial personal cost to make the spells independent and then still the user contagion and spell tolerance are still a problem." Solving the second problem circled back to the first for which there was no easy solution.

A gentle open handed shrug. "Personally I manage alone rather well. But I understand that is rather rare." An oddity that could not be expected of all. "Our need for companionship is one of the main factors that leads to the formation of cabals." Far from the only but it was a major draw.

To talk of Guanxi like debt was not entirely accurate and he himself framed it as such far to often. "That my mistake I think I represented it poorly, Guanxi is less like a debt in the sense someone wont come knocking demanding payment more it is expected that the recipient of Guanxi will of their own accord pay it back with help and favours of their own at some point down the line." And it was a system he rather liked in that encouraged some degree of assistance between mages. "You taught me about foraging, I gave you a cooking lesson." That had been a rather good example of the it in the Moros mind.

A hand raise not to curb the enthusiasm just to set expectations. "I haven't found it yet. Once I do I will let you both know." There was however more. "On a condition same as Aurora agreed to. Any books need to come to me without being read. There is a certain book important to the order that only those who have completed the Arche or higher are allowed to read." So all books came to him to make sure no accidents happened. "And as our recently appointed Censor Aurora will be leading the field work." Keeping information hidden from those not ready for it was the censors job. "Both of those sound good to you?" And the Moros seems a bit tenser as he waits for that answer.

Time, experience and understanding, some might say acceptance. A word the Moros was trying to avoid. "Not a bad way to think of it each step in a process must be compete before you can move on to the next and some steps take time to finish reacting." That was as far as high school chemistry was going to help with the analogy. His mouth sets in a grim line. "No more then usual indeed, it will keep us all on our toes and demand alot and that's just what we know about." What they didn't know about was barely worth considering.

Leaning forward as Guru talks of a monster, not dismissive rather totally accepting, Chambers knew such things walked in the shadows and cracks of the world. "It sounds like a nasty night all in all, I only have one question then I will drop this. Can you confirm for me where this happened?" It was a fairly safe assumption given the nature of Sacramento this old friend wasn't still around.

And now leaning back. "Anytime you like providing I am able to give it and please argue away that's part of he point for people to air grievances or mis conceptions." The Lex mattered and he would take them time to help people with it regardless of what angle there objection came from, providing they were willing to engage in the conversation. "I am no fool I know these things suffer from abuse and misuse, and the Lex is no different but that doesn't mean I can't be a counterforce and provide education on the matter." The Lex wasn't always friendly or nice but understanding how it interacted and why it was written as it was helped alot. "I include the dismissal of the hierarch if they found breaching the Lex as part of the charter to try and show I do not consider myself above it." Lead by example and all that.

Ah a correction to be made. "No not quite what you gave is the effort of fighting pancryptia, the term itself is the word for the active force that conceals knowledge from us, the sleepers reality. The truth doesn't want to be known, it must be worked for." Which brings back to the gnostic gospels. "The force hides knowledge in myth, legend, analogy, scientific principles, destruction, obfuscation." And many more. "So. Why were the Gnostic gospels suppressed is a very important question." There's the tie in.

Good lord how had this not made the news more openly. "That sounds like quiet the dangerous whatever it is the two of yo will be facing." The question that bugs him. "How did the rats get into the people to burst out of them?" Although Guru has a theory. "Water born disease, I didn't catch wind of any out break?" And he worked around death rather intimately. Of course it might not have been a fatal disease.

[Guru]

His hands had unclenched and he shook his head, a deep breath releasing releasing a tension he hadn't been aware he'd been holding. "Just put myself into that situation is all. I have an active imagination." He offered with a half smile even if had just caused him a bit of discomfort. "I think you can get immediate gratification from a larger project if you break it up into sections. I usually set milestones for myself, a little something to celebrate along the way." Also how you tracked yourself but Guru wasn't one that was too close with the concept of Time.


"It's your best best bet but you do lose a little of the nuance." He knew they were splitting hairs at the moment but it had been the original distinction "I think it's an artefact given it worked on its own. I wasn't even a student in prime then so I couldn't begin to study it myself. IF you don't have sufficient standing then who does? We need to make sure we have an appropriate understanding so we can determine an appropriate containment right?" Though that light in his eyes, that thirst for knowledge said there was something more self interested behind that question. Chambers had echoed what he knew the greatest hurdle to be, how did you separate yourself from your work especially when you're acting as a conduit. He gave his nod of acknowledgement as he thought over what was said more than anything.


Guru himself was clearly a social creature, without the ties that bound one person to another he was left to drift. "I've thought about it again but I always feel like there should be a purpose there too. What are you working on together?" Revealing his bias toward action, activity, motion it was clear the shaman kept wanting to push another step further. Though when Chambers took the blame on himself he offered a shake of his head, "Think we're in the middle here as it's part of how I view it, like a debt, obligation, or favor. I don't like unbalanced scales, just a tick to try to correct it."


Hid enthusiasm was curbed when he was explicitly told he wasn't allowed to read the books. It was clear Aurora's new title was news to the Shaman as there was a bit of recognition there before a smile tugged at the corners of his mouth. "No reading, got it. Plus, I'm to follow Aurora's command. I'll eagerly await the call." Though as he thought of the transportation logistics he knew he didn't know anything about Space and as far as he knew neither did Aurora. His immediate solution wouldn't likely leave them of any size too read.


"It's generally what you don't know that kills you. Just need to do what we can to shed light on what we don't know yet." And as his body twisted in discomfort, firmly pointed away and toward an exit. This was a problem he wanted to run from. It took a series of deep breaths before he could answer, "I could show you where it's at. Just know there are rules." He didn't elaborate much more than that and he was quiet through Chambers talk of the Lex though that last point seemed to bring him back. "Did you put a minimum charge, don't think it would be good for stability if leadership can be challenged over every minor infraction. I don't know the first thing about beuracracy but if you need a counterpoint I can provide that."


Posture shifted to face Chambers as the fear had passed and the initial instinct to run had passed. "The process and the journey are just as much a part of it. It is illusive and fickle but doesn't that make the discovery all the sweeter?" Nails dug into stubble as he scratched at his jawline. "Could be because it rang to close to true so the knowledge had to made into myth? Maybe so that way once ones eyes are opened they can see path left along the way."


Guru gave a small laugh as he had his own scattered thoughts shot back at him, "Don't know if disease but there was a pipe break and the nature of the spirit was changed. Partly because of the death that had occurred there shaping the resonance but there was something about the water too. It's a loose connection, I just don't want to discount it. I think the rats are chewing their way through the shadow maybe? I know rat spirits are particularly important...I just can't remember why. It was happening slowly, cyclically...possible the people are ratatouilled and then the rats are just escaping? My instincts are screaming at me that the Shadow is involved somehow."

[Chambers]

Ah but there it was that term people liked to use these days. "Immediate gratification is trap as a see it. Ys seeing your progress is a good thing but it should never be immediate." Gesturing up and around. "The great cathedrals of Europe took hundreds of years to make generations of stone masons passing on the task and many never living to see it finished." Hand coming back down. "Sleepers can't build anything like this now, the knowledge lost in pursuit of quick construction." The buildings of the modern era might be taller, wider, larger but who would say they held a candle to the works of the past.

That curious titbit ruled out artefact if he knew anything at all. "My understanding was sleepers cant use artifacts, was the person using it a mage?" Persistent artifacts much like persistent imbued items always on always doing there thing sure, effected by spells from an artefact yes but to use one to activate one the sleeping soul lacked the supernal sympathy.

The Moros' legs cross and he looks uncomfortable. "At the moment none in Sacramento has the clearance to study artifacts of any power stored in the Athaneum." And that it seemed was painful. "And I must, absolutely set the example." The want was there, the curiosity the spark but it was tempered down held in restraint. "I can't expect others to follow or apricate the orders traditions and teachings if I don't abide them myself." If anything it was a massive pressure to do so. The argument couched in such easy logic, a plea for safety was oh so tempting. "And if I allow my resolve on the matter to swayed for any reason, I would allow a second and third." So no, no examining the artefact for him. "What we do know is imbued item or artefact it is is either a persistent effect always on and always active, or a contingent effect that must be activated by a person performing a specific activation condition." No way around that, magic had its rules to. "So if it has been no trouble thus far, it won't be providing it is left alone." Do what you always have to, work within what you know. Back to basics and find the solution. "Leaving it here will be safe providing no one does anything with it." And providing no one breaks in again, but that should be much harder now. "When the time comes and you are ready it will be one of those milestones you set yourself." Earning the right to study the item.

Somehow cabals are the easier topic now. "Some cabals are thematic yes, some temporary for a certain purpose or some for a duty. Others simply for that companionship and safety." Mages usually survived better in cabals but once again their city was the exception it would seem. Its not the worst way to view. "No, someone should endeavour not to let their Guanxi build up to heavily in either direction." To owe or be owed significant amounts might suggest abuse of the system.

An appraising look holds the Sharman for a handful of heartbeats. "It is an extension of trust I am giving you. Normally only those who have passed the Arche or higher would be sent if there was risk of such a book being in the place, the better not to take risks." And this book oh it mattered. The tone not condensing but heavy this was not a topic the Moros was playing around with.

What on earth happened to him? What monster could make a mage tremble so? What is this place? "That's brave of you to volunteer but it clearly upsets you, telling me will be fine." He could be harsh but he wasn't going to make Guru go back to a place that clearly scarred him not unless things were truly dire, which they most certainly were not. "Many places have rules and we abide what we must." When rules could be writ into fate itself few could claim to understand the concept as well as an awakened with a decent proficiency in that arcana.

A shake of his head. "I did not and intentionally so, I have been appointed as hierarch, Wiest among the wise, the burden should fall greatest on me to uphold would our society values." Leaving himself no wiggle room, no place to go except to fall should he prove unequal to the task, but the demands of it would not change regardless of his being ready to face them or not he has set the events in motion and now had to see it through, or fail in the endeavour. "Should any with sufficient skill in the Lex see fit to challenge me then, there are mean for them to do so and I will weather it or I wont." But the sure fire way to fail was to try and insulate himself from attempts to remove him, that would be the sign he was walking the darker path of the dictator.

After that he sets his face in a gentle smile, its heavy talk and doesn't want to show just how much it weighs. "Yes when you unravel the truth, when you overcome pancryptia and find the magic that was hidden it must be quite the state of elation." He is quick to catch on. "That would be my first guess as well yes, only rather then to be an aid to those who can see it was hidden to keep those cant in the dark." To read the original scripts in their native language would be quite something.

Having very little knowledge for or against any of the theories in question. "Well good work dealing with the spirt." It does beg the question how much goes on that we don't know about? "I don't know much of the shadow, only if it is involved then it escalates the problem." Blinking at the odd word choice. "They are being made into food?" His best guess for what Guru could mean.

The shifting of the shadows across the floor was a record of the time having passed and it was adding up, so crunch time, choice to be made. Studying the man, he was easy to read but that wasn't here nor there, he had an interest in knowledge and a mind that applied things in ways that others might not. He was active and had accepted alot of what was said today in good faith. He would be pushing to hard to ask for then he had gotten today "Very well. Guru if you still want to commit to the Alae Draconis, its traditions and teachings I will cast the divination for you." Another coin flipping in the air, a choice he could not tell the outcome of with certainty but was willing to take a chance on.

[Guru]

"Rome was not built in a day as they say." Voice a blip in the space of the room, his eyes moving to follow the gestures. Architecture was a good analogy, if he tried to apply it to cars he ran against the fact they were safer now. While even now those great projects take more than a handful of years and could be overseen by countless people. How much of the original vision remained? The thought had the Shaman scratching his head before he spoke. "You're not wrong, the immediate answer isn't always the best. I struggle with that sometimes. When to assess and when to act. I usually err on the side of assessment, more information being better. But...it's cost lives before, it's almost cost lives again. IT's not a light memory, more of a scar." He offered with a frown and the emotions there were raw and ragged, loss was clearly difficult for him.


"I-I-I don't know." He stammered a bit of panic in his voice as he thought back to then, the memory mostly a blur but he hadn't checked, couldn't check, no time. His heart hammered in his chest as his eyes were wide when he met Chambers' gaze. "I can't be certain, it's a possibility but it came off as a curse to me. Not something you'd want to do to yourself, unless it went really wrong. But I can give you the specifics when we figure out if and who can study it in the mean time it stays locked up." He cleared his throat as he looked anywhere but where it had been locked last. "I respect leading from the front, it's the same position I would take." Which is part of why I didn't want the role, I'd lose a lot of myself in it. I can't help it. The talk of temptation being a floodgate got a knowing laugh and a rueful grin as he agreed with the milestone. "It's a nice clear one, certainly. Though the path may be winding I haven't given up yet." There was an affirmation there but knowing himself the only way to stay clean was to not partake until he was ready.


An unbidden bitter laughter came at the mention of safety, "Safety is an illusion." He'd seen a lot of the worst that Sacramento had to offer and he had just scrapped the surface. A breath and he untensed, "But our odds improve with numbers. If you want to go fast, go alone. If you want to far, go together." A lot of the points weaving themselves together to for a clearer picture. And as the tone shifted to something more serious his hands shot up in surrender already, "I won't crack a spine. I'll just give it to Aurora or let her handle it." The surrender was complete and immediate, mostly because Guru knew if he even peaked he wouldn't be able to keep his word.


"It was supposed to be a party. Secrets and a party all wrapped up together, most people probably walked away with a laugh and fond memory." Another loose dismissive shrug as he scratched uncomfortably as the back of his head. "It's just a Nexus for the strange. I'll write down the address for you before I head out." More than happy to take the out for now. Though when they spoke on politics it was his turn to shift uncomfortably as he made a face before he spoke quietly, "That's you. What about who comes after? What if it isn't the wisest it's just the strongest?" What if, What if, What if, it was a question that repeated in his head with the spin and clatter of a roulette wheel. "It might not be new but it still feels like the first time it's ever been discovered. Like speaking of it out loud might unravel the very essence of what it is. It's the longest journey there is." A wistful smile on his face, like a boy with a shovel with fresh earth to move. Their minds traveling similar avenues of thoughts separately from the other but it was also the realization that he still had limitations.


He shrugged off the thanks with the spirit, it was his job. Which is why he knew he was lacking and needed to help out on that end a little more seeing a gap in knowledge at a minimum. "I'm working on it, the familiar is a good idea. I'll let you know how much I find out." When he mentioned being made into food Guru looked confused and then amused before he let out a small laugh, "No, like the movie. A guy is basically puppetted by a rat. It's a fun, family movie. Just a theory but it gives me something to prepare for." And then Guru could have shot up and hugged Chambers at the pronouncement and it was clear he was restraining himself given his normally bombastic reactions. "Of course!" He could still only contain so much of his excitement, though he wasn't sure of what to expect. I know you want to untangle those mysteries as well but we have to focus.

[Chambers]

The Moros had more control of emotional state by no means perfect as things had slipped today but death and loss he handled well, better then most wit ha soul awakened to Stygia that is likely of little surprise. "Knowledge is power, but must be tempered by wisdom." When to act and how. "It a lesson we never stopping learning, not of those who actually want to achieve things." And no order embodied those ideas like the Mysterium did.

Guru being panicky about past experiences seemed at odds with the cool way he was assessing going to a place where people we dying in bloody agony, did it bode poorly for field work or had those experiences truly been so traumatic? "For the time being I am fairly sure we have no one regardless of its classification so yes proper storage for now." And talk of leadership is less then welcome he wasn't trying to lead the Mysterium he had plenty enough with a Consilium to manage. And it results in a sigh. "I wanted to become a curator when I first arrived, but what I wanted and what has been needed of me are two different things so I have put that aside and contended myself to my position as one to help others rise higher." To help them attain what he had wanted but was not meant to be. "Regardless I try to live by example as best I can." He would like to have done more field work as well but no administration seemed to be his lot.

With the message received the harsh tone is not brought out again. "Very good, she knows she isn't to open nay either." It really was a case of working with what was available. And if it all panned out then well the order would be one step closer to being better for it.

An eyebrow raises slowly. "If the rumours are truly and there was a public murder of a magic with what we understand to be vulgar magic in that place I think many would have walked away with either worry or fascination." But he knew about other things that crept through the shadows of vampires and shape changing beasts well he knew in theory never having met any. But that's nothing knew Skye had told him about the place. "The address would be very welcome, thank you." More looking to confirm as much as he could.

Now politics. "Yes its highly unlikely I will be around forever. Which is why I have to set the example, encourage the things our society values and guide the Consilium in such a way as if my time should come whoever steps up next can build on what I started not tear it down." All he could do was try. "If someone tries to take the position by force rather then discussion then well we have a council system for that." And he had made sure of it. "The Charter does state the councillors will decide who fills the position of hierarch so hopefully the wisest of each path between them can steer things." He lacked sufficient skill to account for every possibility but he had put what safe guards he could in place.

A nod in appreciation that Guru would keep in informed. "Oh right yes I have seen it, just been a very long time." It hadn't been the go to place for his mind probabaly because he himself cooked. But as interesting as this was it was time for the matter at hand.

"I suggest you put you hands over your ears for a moment."

Remaining seated Chambers flips the pipe in his hand so the bowl is gripped in his pam and the stem faced away from him, the wand of bone ready to guide his will working. Then he seeks the imago of the spell, a divination to determine and guide Guru future in the Mysterium forgoing across the abyss reality tries to buck at the vulgar disruption of the lie and his nimbus flares the howling screaming shades of Stygia give terrible voice to a choir of anguish and despair and lamenting, a multitude chorus of woe and misery. But Abyss is held at bay not interfering and the cyan glyph forms.

Paradox failure

Date	Action	Roll	Result
2025-05-31 05:21:20	Chambers rolls 1 to Paradox base 2 -1 disciple level spell -1 tool, absorb suxx as backlash (10 Again, Chance)	9	failure

Divination 1 success

Date	Action	Roll	Result
2025-05-31 05:22:23	Chambers rolls 8 to Divination time 3 gnosis 3 HS +2 -6 (Known connection, no name) (QF mitigates 3 dice of penalties)+wp (10 Again, WillPower)	2, 5, 9, 4, 2, 3, 5, 7	1 success

"What must Guru donate to advance in the Mysterium." Eyes unfocused lost to the moment as he glimpses hints of the shamans future. The images rarely moved a mage of their Sophiad which is why knowing helped it added context to the hints. "I saw formula and equations inked on paper, wrought in metal." And that was all the casting could give him this time. "It's not to much to go on I apologise. When you have something you think qualifies you can bring it to any member of the order who has completed the Arche or higher to be considered. Some use gut instinct, others like myself use magic to determine if it the fulfilment." And well unless Aurora passed the Arche first it would be to Chambers.

Shaking of his limbs after the cast just a moment to reorient. "Congratulations. Among members of the order you may use the title Neokoros inferior, you may receive lessons from any Athenaea in any Arcanum up to the apprentice proficiency, you may use the publicly recognised signs of the Mysterium The book and key, the golden pen and the sing language for the letter M." Which Chambers demonstrates. (Pinky to the ball of the hand, thumb tucked in, remaining fingers over the thumb). "If some one touches their piny finger to their septum even in subtle ways such as holding a book in such a way as to cause the motion it indicates the mystagogue in question is of superior rank to you." And of course. "You can declare yourself a official member of the Mysterium some do this subtle by working the word wing into a sentence." That the secretive part done. "No items of any kind yet." Even high speech was only reserved for those passing the Arche.

[Guru]

It was true but it was always good to hear it from an outside perspective. "At the very least I'll have multiple experiences to draw upon. I believe it was our Main Man Newton who said 'What I know is a drop, what I don't know is an ocean.' If we don't remember to stay humble, well, reality will find a way to humble us." The last bit seemed mostly directed to himself, most of his conversations with his peers was a good reminder of that. All of them being brilliant in their own right. When Chambers mentioned his want for curator Guru stilled, turned, and it was clear that even briefly he had his undivided attention. "But you have a higher calling now, I can understand the disappointment but there's no telling what the future has to hold. Not easily or with any real accuracy at least. What is it that you want now?" Brow raised quizzically the difference in demeanors a subject of curiosity for the Shaman who couldn't fathom not having a burning fire raging inside him at all times.


"They're true but that's not even the worst that happened. It was a fine evening up until it wasn't, good metaphor for life in hindsight. It's good until it isn't." He gave a nervous laugh the nightmares of the evening apparently attached to the end of the evening. He'd had to have been carried away at the end of the evening and it would have been better if it had just been drugs. The talk of politics an unusually welcome relief for him though he thought Chambers was entirely too optimistic about what would happen after. Guru clicked his tongue against the roof of his mouth as his eyes looked up at the ceiling in thought before coming back down a few heartbeats later nodding. "Fair. Normally I would say Power abhors a vacuum but there was a vacuum of power here for awhile. Should we put a clause in there for if no one steps up? Force a vote until you have a majority like a in a jury?"


There was a question on his face at the request but he put his hands over his ears, elbows forward. Guru was always fascinated and drawn in by the casting of others and if this had been a different context he would have scrutinized the spell but doing that know would show mistrust at the least. So Faith, he would take Chambers at his word. Especially given the sounds that had followed, his earmuffs only doing so much to kill that wail. The flash of a glyph after all was said and done was his only relief given the color. That was his cue to remove the earmuffs and listen, elbows shifting to his knees as he leaned forward intently.


As Chambers described it he could almost see it himself, his first instincts showing him formulae wrought in iron which was a fairly permanent material even compared to stone. Though the second image that came to mind was something more elegant, a tome bound and locked. As Chambers offered his apologies it broke Guru's own vision and a smile crept up on his face with a laugh, "I think I have a few directions I can take that so it's more than you think." He listened intently recognizing the sign and bowing his head in respect knowing being bestowed the signs and symbols of the Mysterium was an extension of trust and faith in him in turn. "So turn in anything I find, easy enough. I'll do what I can not to let you all down. Anything we need just let me know, I prefer to keep working until I have to stop." He laughed but he had been dead serious, he didn't like being idle, didn't even know if he was capable of being idle.