Order Meeting VIII

[Corn]

Corn waits. Minutes turn to hours, but he waits. He picks up a book from those he had brought there after a while, but he cannot concentrate. And then, finally, after several hours there is the verdict.
Corn listens to what Chambers said. It is not much but more than he had. And it was not Alex.
Corn breathes. It was not Alex. His son's body is not down a sewer that the police have not yet found. Enemies have Cloud, but Cloud is probably alive.
"Thank you. Thank you very much. Could it be someone that purposefully downgraded his or her sympathy with me?" Not that he assumes the kidnapper would have been someone he had discussions with, but it is better to be sure.

Is the other spell that writes the final name still active?

After Chambers answers that question, Corn puts words in the question that has been forming on his mind all those hours he was waiting for the verdict.
"Aside of an impressive use of magic, this was valuable help as we now know more than we did. This was not just a nudge of help, this was finding proof that it was not my brother-in-law, which can and will significantly help the investigation.
Why? Why do you help me? You have said you would help me, but this... " he motions towards Chamber's jacket "is above and beyond what anyone expected. Especially for a mage with my baggage, and you actually don't like. I am of little help to you. My standing with the consilium after what I have done comes out will be irrevocably damaged. I understand you want to keep your word but you could have fulfilled that without putting so much on the table. Honestly, I am not sure I would have cast the spell a 3rd time in your shoes. I have been ... of very little help on my own cause. "
Let alone that you know I am dangerously careless with words and thus with thoughts and ill-thought spells can actually cause tremendous damage by accident, he thinks but doesn't add.

"This... " he nods towards the jacket that held his momentary name. "This is a secret you shared with all of us. After all I have said and done and said," (yes, "said" was used twice) "you trust me with such a secret. You shared that with me. Why? Guanxi with me is of little value as I am and there's a good chance our enemies - or the Guardians - will see me dead or banished. "

1 success

Date	Action	Roll	Result
2024-11-12 14:10:43	Corn rolls 4 to Wits+Empathy (10 Again)	3, 10, 7, 6, 6	1 success

Empathy here is for Corn to figure why Chambers has been so... accommodating to Corn's stupidity.

[Chambers]

Careless miscount on my part. I got my target 5 suxx in2 rolls the third was not need. I am spending the wp to reimagine the spell just so everything is above board

Having just spent nearly five hours in ritual casting without a break to say his joints had got a little restless was true enough. And some time is spent stretching the ache out. "I don't know. They could well have, such magic does exist. I rarely get to cast that on mages so I have no seen if it changes the name in any discernible way." You would have to imagine but it is a niche example, hard to come across, and not what the spell was meant for.

As he clears away chambers would systematically end the spell in question. It has no further use for the day and he was not about to spend another significant portion of his time in ritual casting. Leaving his jacket blank. To Aurora's concern. "Thank you but no I'm alright. Not my first ritual and I highly doubt it will be my last." But a warm smile is sent her offer appreciated. The remnants of the bones, thread and burnt out tea lights all go into the bag the bones had first come in. That would be properly handled later. "My apologies, that took a while." Well aware that all present could gauge his relative power by the time it took him to perform a ritual.

Corns question catches him off guard. "No I don't like you." Harsh thing to focus on first perhaps. "But I don't need to like you to help you." Settling now back into his seat. "I helped you because for no more or less reason then I said I would." And he did not think himself some better then thou preacher. He tried to live by the standards set upon him as both a mage and a member of the Mysterium. "Call me a traditionalist if you will, but traditions help us put ego aside." The assorted pieces. Pipe, bag of burnt sacraments and chalk begin disappearing back into his jacket. "I could have done less, given less yes. But the need to start eliminating possibilities is important. Knowing it is very unlikely to be your blood relations." Because nothing was entirely certain. "I would need to check your connections with them to be entirely sure." But it is enough to go on for now. "Puts a major question mark over the published story and suggests a lot more strongly that someone or something has made efforts to stage this kidnapping to keep mundane law enforcement at bay." Which made it a best case scenario a serial killer able to stage a crime scene.

The why was more or less explained already. "The rotes of my legacy are what I am most skilled in. I chosen to use them now because they can cut to the truth of a matter that has been largely obfuscated. And I do ask that if you can replicate this spells you do not. There are risks involved if they are not treated with respect." Both a legacy of angry mages able to find you easily and the nature of our magic is far more complicated then just this. "Besides Guanxi is based on good will is it not? And this was knowledge of interest to you, that you needed." Not just some random tirade of questionable facts. "This how the practice was intended to be used, if more often in less serve instances." And it is not like Chambers is walking away with nothing today. A notable headache and a conversation with the council he has no idea how to begin navigating right now for starters.

[Guru]

Guru had remained quiet through much of the questioning but not still. Foot tapping a steady rhythm his jaw clenching and unclenching showing his visible discomfort but keeping his restraint for now. Though as Corn needed context to his own questions, "You were seeking knowledge in how to teach Sleepers or seeking others with knowledge who could. This quest for information are the answers I refer to. Did your search lead you to break the lex or bring unto us trouble?" He stated it as plainly as he could think to make it.


He had to mentally check off all the same crimes he was guilty of that Corn was. Though the last one stood out the most as Guru had been in the same boat though he'd been trying to save his subject at the time. The compunctions of stealing wasn't anything he was morally opposed to doing himself, it was the taking it by force instead of stealth. Add on the fact that he had been an Apostate himself not so long ago and would likely have defended himself lethally given the opportunity. "You're lucky that you didn't suffer any casualties then. I know if I came across a group of mages in my home I might not have a home afterwards but I wouldn't have any intruders either." He offered a shrug, material wealth meant little to him for a great many reasons. The intrusion seemed to upset him more than the thought of a sleeper being killed in the line of duty. "Let's not forget the fact two Councilors were apparently involved in the B and E." That bit of information certainly not lost on him.


He was the odd man out on the loss of life, it was unfortunate but he could certainly see Corn's perspective. He was in a corner, didn't have a lot of time to think and had to come to a decision right or wrong without the blessings of Arcadia to know otherwise. A stillborn child was one thing but a sleeper in the middle of knowledge they had no right to? Guru shook his head, "I know I might be the odd man out here given my past. My respect for the rule of law is..." he held his fingers up about an inch apart with a shrug. He'd never exactly made it a secret. "But he killed a sleeper in the line of duty retrieving a grimoire they should not have had. We can verify the story with San Fran as it was their crime to judge. If it hasn't occured again it's not a pattern of behavior."


Guru didn't like that others could see the spells in his pattern but he also didn't want to walk around unprotected either. He gave up some security for others and was working on the rest long term but he knew Chambers was right. It was a beacon, a trail in which follow. "He's right and the longer it remained on her pattern the more opportunity they would have to find more. Imagine being a curious mage and introducing yourself to her only to get her true name or dead skin from a handshake? It's an opening, an opportunity."


"I have to agree with Corn here and disagree with you Chamber's. While there might not be a statute for the crime if you really have a problem and wish to admonish someone for bad behavior the only opportunity you have is in the moment, the longer you let it go the more you say it doesn't matter. Though I don't know if this was six weeks ago or six months ago but the point still stands, it should have been raised then. Crimes have statutes for a reason, otherwise that Apostate might go to a larger city, and we might be at War tomorrow." A shrug of his shoulders because that could happen because the Law was dumb and was only there to serve those who held power as Chamber's only proved in his mind as he used his influence to push crimes from the past. "If we're going to charge for crimes of the past we might as well all hang."

[Aurora]

She had said she wouldn’t say anything more, but hell, sometimes you feel compelled. And she felt compelled. “Because there are good people out there Corn who when they say they will do something, they do it. Despite everything else, they do what they say they will do.” That was all there was to it. But he was right, it went above and beyond what she had expected him to do. It spoke volumes of his character and his ability to still help someone despite all the mistakes and dangers they had put not only themselves, but the community as a whole in.

The offer of assistance wasn’t expected to accepted, but the smile was returned with a nod. She would have of course helped if he had asked. A hand dismissed the apology, “No worries at all, the time went by quickly, I got a lot done.” Once she got into her work, she could be in it for hours, time meant nothing.

Now him agreeing that he didn’t like Corn was a surprise. Not many would just outright admit it, she knew she would, but she had run out of fucks to give a long time ago. But this from him wasn’t completely unexpected. Given the words exchanged and topics discussed.

Finally, Guru speaks up.

“The problem is that there continues to be problems without consequences. When a mage is allowed to skirt the Law and continue to break it, they grow accustomed to it, they begin to see themselves as above it, they make excuses for their behavior and it keeps happening. It’s a vicious cycle, it keeps happening until they either make a big enough screwup that simply cannot be ignored or they hurt innocent Sleepers or other Awakened. Then it becomes, why didn’t we handle it before it got to that point? We are at the point where more serious laws are at risk of being broken or have been broken. It’s a pattern and it needs to be handled before the actions kill someone.” closing her notebook, "No one has said what Corn will be held accountable for, only that the Council will meet and be brought up to date on what has happened and what has been brought to light. It could be decided that what happened in the past will be left in the past, or not. I don't know. But we can't keep running from our pasts and the mistakes we may have made in them."

[Corn]

Corn nods as Chambers speaks and nods. Nothing truly unexpected there. He also agrees with Aurora when she says that Chambers has integrity and nods to her remark too.
And then, the other Shaman speaks.

No, Guru don't ... I took Guru down with me, Corn thinks. But then Aurora offers a reasonable and moderate answer to what could be considered ... well, controversial (to say the least) view on the Lex and the rule of law in order to support a mage that did bad things. How to answer this one, without sounding hypocritical?
"Guru, thanks you for your support." Corn said softly, with a smile - he truly appreciated the support at this point.
"However, Chambers spoke correctly before - inconvenient as it may be for me. Aurora is also right. Worry not, my friend. When the council is informed, they will take into account what happened and how and that some of the actions revealed here have been weighted in the past by other consilia."
His mind goes to a few years back.
"If I may, Aurora probably recalls that, a few years ago, a well respected mage cast a spell to put some Sleepers to sleep, for their own safety. I was a councilor at the time. During the trial, I had a similar view like you - no real harm done and the Sleepers and the world were safer for that spell. But those were not our laws.
And as a young apostate told me at the time... we are Awakened. We don't do the good thing, we should do the wise thing. It didn't matter if what that mage did saved the Sleepers, it was a breach of the Lex and I was wrong to judge the action based on human morality.
The mage in question got a penance for the breach... and few of us - only one person comes to mind - thought any less of that mage. On the other hand the mage that said 'no penalty, she did the right thing', that was me by the way, found himself in hot water for months. I have not broken the Lex, but I have not shown respect or understanding of the Lex. The mage that breached? They did their minor penance with dignitiy and that was it. Honestly, that mage mentioned that the penance was not a real penance. "

Will Guru get the message that respect for the Lex is something we should display or at least even if we don't have it we should not openly state it when another mage is being clobbered by it? Corn hoped he would.

[Chambers]

Guru is at first listened to as chambers settles back into one of the window alcove seats. Clarifying what he had asked Corn some hours past. And then adding in the sentiment that a cabal had the right to use lethal force in defence of their sanctuary. and a lone mage might as well anyway. "Yes two councillors were present. But unless I missed it and Aurora was one, because I know I was not. Those councillors are not in this room." And being councillors did not exclude them from the Lex or making poor choices. "Words will need to be had about the importance of acting with wisdom. And the thinking through what repercussions our actions might have." Instead of acting in ways that risked open warfare. "The reason we have laws that protect sanctums is so cabals should not need to worry about finding intruders in their sanctums, so any they do find can be treated as at best left handed." It really was amazing how much conflict and be could be avoid if the lex was respected. "But we don't know if it was a cabal or not yet so." A slightly tired shrug. It could be fine.

The following statement from the Sharman gets his attention and forces the Moros to wonder just how many Iconoclasts had been allowed through doors into places from which they should have been barred. That might be an indication why no divination was provided. Did someone intentionally prevent Guru from progressing in the order? "The Mysterium does not kill. It does not destroy. Knowledge must be preserved. It is hard. I know that. We don't always get it right I know that. But never sleepers." They had the power of gods at their command when the sleepers had nothing. There are always other choices. Harder choices. But that is what we do.

As for why the Lex matters. Well Aurora has it covered. She speaks well. Articulating just so, that this was a wider discussion. He nods in support of her words. Anything he has to say on the matter would only be heavy handed. And sometimes nothing more need be said. All in all she can handle her path mate, maybe guide him to some kernels of wisdom.

But then all things Corn shows humility. Wisdom even. Maybe something good did come of today. The tale of the previous enforcement of the lex is interesting. With no spell up to confirm the truth of the details it is taken with a pinch of salt but still. "Yes. The wise thing." And that could be the hardest thing of all to do. "Not the good. Not the easy. Not the impulsive. When we know what we do. We must strive to be wise. In all things." Speaking in support of Corn's sentiment there. Because well on this matter he was right. And it so often starts with small things. Building habits and behaviours.

[Guru]

Guru listened as the others spoke, the matter had had enough time to create distance for him. For him to disinvest himself of his own personal feelings of the matter, so he listened and nodded along first to Aurora. "That would be the pattern of behavior then. I agree that that's why we have the Lex. Might be worth adding to the list of questions when accepting new mages into the city if we want to set that precedent. Rules have to be enforced for them to matter and no one single mage can be above them." I just don't want to open the door to everyone's personal, past, and likely petty grievances. "Only reason I brought up the other fact." A look to Chambers because he spoke of justice and rigid thinking. This is why I do not make those claims, and why I do not envy our Councilors their burden.


Never. Not once in any reality. Sure. He was glad Chambers got to hold those lofty ideals. Though but that was because he was removed from much of the noise, much of the chaos. Could he really judge anyone? Guru looked around the room, no, Aurora would be the one he would trust in that instance. "Life should be preserved beyond that, you won't find argument from me there. My fight is to preserve it. I just know sometimes choices have to be made on a knife's edge or at the end of a gun, and the options are sometimes never good." Yes they were mages now, the gun had to be bigger but they all still had points of leverage. Cloud was unfortunately the living proof of that.


He didn't feel as if his friend had been dragging him down, Aurora had provided the necessary insight and comfort. It wasn't a formal charge as Guru had thought but elucidating the facts to bring further context to the given investigation. He hadn't been seeing it from that perspective and knew his faith in her as Councilor was proven over again. Corn and Chambers speaking of Wisdom had him nodding his agreement but pinching his nose at the same time. "No, the Wise thing is often the difficult thing. why I prefer the long and winding path, to give ample time to weigh options and make decisions." Because as they found out, fortunately or not, he would try to argue anything. The whole situation had his head throbbing, he hated how complicated politics were, there were far too many variables to consider. This is also why you keep hesitating when it matters though, it's how you'll keep losing people too. What's the right answer though?