Tea and talks on the river

[Chambers]

Of the reasons he had committed to his chosen pursuit of seeing the Consilium restored. Earning praise had not been among them. "What I have done is only what any mage given time and stud is capable of. But yes I do think awakened word needs to mean something, so if a commitment is made it should be held to." When the Consilium was still far from secure or established, with many obstacles still to over come that he received such praise was in away concerning. I would prefer help to a pedestal. "And from what I hear you must have quite the history in the city from the respect other returning mages have for you." Fair turn around and all.

The topic of self defence seemed to be one of those ever present things on fringe of things that would be good to have but has yet to manifest. "I think you would see some take up if you did, it was discussed for a while. I think the primary obstacle was corn wanting to use automatons." After I talked him down from murder robots. A few moments are spent in contemplation. "But I would wager having someone who actually knows what they are doing would be very welcomed." Corn nor any of the others who had suggested to run such training had manifested, it would be curious to see if that trend broke.

Listening calmly, followed by a gentle nod. "I see, my apologies I misunderstood you." The talk of personal use had thrown him it seems. "Yes art for others is a risky affair. If hey know or risk learning of our nature." Which is why shadow names, covers and false identities.

Talk of philosophy is always interesting, particularly awakened philosophy although it of course required a little more care. Although what self respecting mystagogue would not care for any tit bit, any tease of anything that harkened back to Atlantis itself. "The necessity of opposition." An understandable concept although he was willing to admit he probabaly didn't grasp the full weight of it in a way am member of the order who held such ideals would. "If I understand it, the idea that without a challenge to overcome you are more likely to stagnate or not show worth?" Always better to ask one who knows. "The Mysterium has protocols as well and in unusual twist for us they are not secrets." A gentle smile at his jest poking fun at the perceived reputation of his order as jealous hoarders of arcane lore and secrets. "But we only have four of those." Not that it was a contest. "My order encourages the practices of right scholarship, right exchange, right apprenticeship, and right authority." A pause to drink his tea and provide an opening for questions should there be any interest.

Placing his cup down on one of the many surfaces that dot his living area he takes the time to compose his thoughts on the matter. "I pushed for this model to minimise conflict where possible. And respect the orders." Lets start in reverse. "For example do you know who the right person to go to is if you want to talk to the guardians or Mysterium in as an order?" He knew who the guardians in their midst were but who actually dealt with the public matters he had no clue. "As for the conflict well." This risks bruising a few egos. "The watchtowers are our connection to supernal truth. To wisdom. What awakened us before the vast majority even knew of the orders." Unless a very privileged sleepwalker or proximi happened to awake. "Mages come in every character I understand that. But the watchtowers provide a first point of common ground. A way to facilitate a conversation and feel the person representing you does actually have some common ground with you. Regardless of how high or low the order representative actually stands. The truth of the path will always be known to those who walk it." And how to put this. "And order ideology can clash much harder then path in my experience. Path is a matter of empathy and understanding we have differing experiences. Orders are things we tend to choose and thus defend with more fervour and more readily." There was no fool proof system and the Moros did not think to have found one, he was simply trying to facilitate things as best he was able. "I am open to criticisms of my process, if you think I have erred please." Opening the conversation, seemingly unafraid of putting his models to the test.

[Phoenyx]

The lithe woman shrugs. "The Arrows beleive strongly in standing by our words. I swore an Oath to protect the Concillium. While I may not have tried to rebuild a Charter, I have focused on ensuring the mages are protected. Some have seen this more directly than others." She sips her tea again. "If there is anything in the History that might be useful I would be happy to provide it to the Concil, although much of what I know Aurora does as well."

Phoenyx sighs a little at the mention of Automatons. "I had heard such things. I consider it too big a risk. I hope the return of the Arrows has put such things to rest."

A shake of the head is given with asmall smile. "No apology necessary." It was easy to interpret such things differently, especially if there was a crossed medium.

The Arrow smiles a little wider. "Just so. We refer to the precept as 'Existance is War.' This can be interpreted in many ways; not stagnating is a good alternate phrasing. Our worth is ion our Service and duty to the Pentacle. The tenat is about challenging ourselves to develop our skills in all fields, not just combat." She nods - The Mysterium's laws mostly made sense, however... "Right authority? As in, who has the right to hold Authority over people or places?" Her tone wasn't accusatory, simply curious.

The question doesn't seem like a test; still, it felt appropriate to answer. The Arrow could be incredibly literal. "Winter and Aurora, as the mages of those Orders that have been in the city the longest." She frowns a little, thinking. "I am not sure I see the conflict, but I was more referring to new arrivals already in an Order. Our Watchtowers ties us to the Supernal as individuals but it is a place anyone not on a Path can theoretically encounter, guided by their experience but not what they take from those experiences. It isn't a common ground of principle, it is a common place everyone on our respecive Path has been. Ideologies between orders are more in opposition, but when assessing a new Mage seeking acknoweledgement does it not provide a smoother introduction to have a guarantee of commonalities borne of Order?" The Arrow argues with a calm logic engaging with the discussing Chambers has with a differing opinion.

[Chambers]

An inclination of the head. "It's a good belief to have." One that he could still see many ways to interpret but the premise was certainly admirable. "It is a endeavour I have no doubt has been and will be appreciated." The idea that times would always be quite and calm was not one he subscribed to. "When I arrived we had more or less nothing to go off, any unresolved mysteries or investigations, threats, hotspots. It would all be appreciated. Certain things have filtered through or been hinted at." He had nothing to trade for this he was well beyond his efforts to see things restored and standards upheld.

A gentle laugh that requires him to put his tea down. "You, me, and I think most mages in the Consilium. But I haven't heard him mention them for awhile so I hope he has listened to the value of why they would not be ideal for the Consilium." He had no way to know if that was due to the sudden arrival of several arrows or not.

He listens politely as Phoenyx expounds just a little on arrow philosophy. "Your not wrong." He could not fault the arrows logic on that. They were in a constant war for reality. But it seemed deeper and more personal then that. "Would I be right in thinking the enemy of this war is the self in a sense? Or is it in reference to our wider existence?" Maybe both?

That right authority is the protocol to be queried was interesting. Normally people like to go for right exchange. "Yes. We are not the free council. We have and support structures of authority. The protocol of right authority helps us remove bias and politics to a degree and establish those hierarchies." It could an interesting conversation for sure. "Right authority encourages consideration of exceptional qualities in a mage. The ability to progress through legitimate power structures. The degree of power a mage possesses and by virtue the truth and knowledge such a mage possess this is usually viewed by rote knowledge and gnosis." Far from qualities for leadership in and of themselves. "But must always be tempered by sanity. And those who can't adhere to the social norms of the pentacle should not even be considered for leadership or governing positions. After all considerations those who lead should display the proper attitude. They should be teachers, not lords." And that was just the the protocol in its simplest form. His tea is reclaimed as he finishes his own explanation.

A slight shake of the head not condescending merely indicating a wrong answer. "I chose those two orders because they are archetypically most secretive. And like to remain so. We do not have a curator in the Mysterium currently." A self evident truth. No public face, no steadying hand. His fingers entwining around his cup as he considers. "I disagree with you here I am afraid. While there will not be identical philosophy I am not suggesting such. There are certain truths of each realm, each watchtower." And besides that. "I also think you have missed something. Who would handle the apostates who wish to join the Consilium if it is handled by order representatives?" The unique nature of Sacramento made it hard to gauge what should be in place but paths seemed easier to represent then orders.

[Phoenyx]

The Arrow nods. "Once we have addressed the Charter, I could provide some key past events. While considering the Charter I can cover parts of history if they become pertinent as examples."

How much should philosophy of an order be revealed? The Arrows were not a Secretive order, in the widest sense. They had always protected, and those that are protected needed to know what principles guided their guardians... Ironically making the Guardians of the Veil highly mistrusted. "Not a war upon the self. More a battle against complacency, apathy. We watch for our enemies, even in times of seeming peace. Arrows are encouraged to take considered action, not endless debate. It is balanced by another tenet - the Supernal is the Self. We are supernal beings and contain universes. As awakened souls, we are rare and have value, but only if we strive to achieve our potential. If we commit ourselves, there is no limit we cannot eventually surpass. This is not done without action."

Phoneyx listens to the outline of Authority with an interested expression. When the Moros reaches for his tea, she nods. "The Arrows are very similar. We prefer an established hierarchy, though more for orders to be issued effectively in the field. Similarly though rank is not based solely on combat skill alone but strategy, achievement and Wisdom. It also comes with responsibility. It is said a Throne is a Warrior's prison. It grants prestige, but restricts our freedom with responsibilities and duty. For my Order, this is reflected by many avoiding titles unless they tie into our oaths, duties or ethics." The Obrimos had clear belief in her Order's structure and rules. It was what she had been taught, and she held it close.

Her face turned into a frown. Phoenyx had clearly misunderstood, but still felt she did and had been tricked in some way. She watches Chambers thoughtfully. "As you have said, mages are more likely to be more committed to their Orders and it allows a common link, a mutually respectful access into a new city. Based on that alone it would make introductions easier, where members of the same Watchower may have less immediately obvious commonalities. I would be curious to see where you and Corn have your similarities based on watchtower alone." The Arrow pulled a wry smile. She did have a sense of humour, it was just spartan and dry. Still, it felt like a valid example. "I did not, I wished to posit the argument first. Since the Concillium has clearly decided to continue a Council of Paths, I was attempting to posit an alternative pathway that would benefit the majority of Mages. With the structure continuing as extant, any mage would attempt to find their councilor first. Failing that, an initiated mage would consult the ranking member of their Order while an Apostate would seek other members of their Path." She watches Chambers, a little smile playing on her lips. It was nice to have intellectual debate in a peaceful environment.