Shuffling the deck

[Helen Kingsley]

"You look the right side of thirty for those purposes. If you're forty or so... Well done, you, I guess." Always hard to tell with people, but Verity for one does cultivate the impression, whether intentionally or not, well. Who knows ? "Because that in no way raises questions. Haven't some people called that girl a vampire already ?"

"Eh, it depends a lot on what's a good time and what means you got. Club experience for some, others don't give a shit as long as they can get totally sloshed on what little they got because it beats the shitty life they got. That foul stuff is either what they think is included in the good time or its collateral damage they can ignore as long as it doesn't directly violate their fun time." She shrugs. "That sort of people either have a get out of jail free card or they are in no position where rumours or reputations are something that's important to them. Or they're try-hards who desperately want to make sure they get the right reputation and fuck it up along the way."

Helen laughs.

"TV and shit glitz it up and more and more folks think they got the skills and stomach for that kind of stuff, although they really don't. Then they see a knee bent the wrong way or a thumb going into an eye socket and all they do is say hello to breakfast again. As you say, they buy into their own hype, but fail to deliver. Whatever way that goes. Or they kind of deliver, but it doesn't get them the rep or respect they want. I got a sorta fun tale to illustrate from way back, wanna hear it ?

Eh, my friends are pretty enthusiastic about those sort of things. get some steam off and all that. I'm the first to admit we might have gone a bit overboard there." She leans back and looks righzt back at verity while turning a few ideas around in her head. "I'd take a look, nosey bitch that I am, but if my gut tells me to walk at any point, I'll do exactly that." She laughs, again. "Jenn and me aren't really having competitions in clothing, I don't think 'who wears it better' is something she's too concerned about as soon as stuff is not formal. And it ain't really something I'm concerned about as well." She nods. "Yeah, devil always shits on the biggest pile. Especially the good non-management types leave or move on in the long run way too often. She was no different."

Helen makes a face. "Eh, that's just shitty, letting a bit of birdcrap get all over a concert." She's not totally serious, though. "Sounds like that smaller band was just shit out of luck, eh ? If they didn't even register enough to be of note, I guess you were there for the other guys, too ?"

"Themed bad sex, now I've seen everything !

Sounds like a great place for the stuff it's aimed at. Do you know if the place still exists ?"

[Verity Carmen]

All sweet smiles. ''That's so nice of you.'' While it was always nice to hear, a topic perhaps best moved on from. ''Oh her.'' She laughs a little. ''Yeah I think I've seen that online.'' She tries to mimic Helen Geddit face from earlier. ''A dam pretty vampire though.'' See I can play to.

Verity looks away, looks down, to the dance floor below them. ''I'm all for a good time don't get me wrong. But there is no reason to get nasty about it, or put a downer on everyone else's good time.'' Pause to drink. ''If your life is shit. Do something about it rather then wasting away what little you have.'' Is she getting frustrated about something. ''I knew a lot of those types. The ones who would complain and whine but when it came to doing something, anything melted away.'' When it becomes escapism it should be sign something needs to change. She looks back to Helen. ''Internet as it is, those get of jail free cards don't hold up like they used to.'' Word can spread further and faster then damage control. ''And all the old excuses are worn and tired.'' Rattling out the same excuses over and over its all been heard before.

Her smile does creep back now though. ''Oh those, I can do that Hollywood types, those are the worst. But watching them fail never fails to be satisfying.'' Good point. ''And yes a good point. The Macho image of using force on everyone and thing around hasn't held the test of time has it.'' Looking back in Helen's direction. ''Oh please do tell.'' This should be good.

Dangerous as it is to do with kindred Verity fully meets Helens gaze eye to eye. ''Noted. If I'm ever somewhere I think you could liven up I'll let you know where to find me.'' I think that's the best I'm going to get. ''I don't know have you seen some of none formal stuff recently? She out gothed me at a goth club.'' Not rock exactly but yeah come on that is close enough to my scene. ''Not that I am complaining mind.'' She wore it dam well, and it was a good night. ''I haven't heard that one before.'' And don't exactly get what it's meant to mean either. Her face goes passive rather then confused as tries to muddle it out. ''It does just seem to be the way doesn't it.'' A couple have done just that since I've been around.

Laughing, musical tones mingle with the performance. ''Isn't it just, the spirt of the show must go on they did not have.'' And lost a lot of respect for it. ''Would have been way better if they took a page from Ozzy's book, the whole bat thing. Keep going no matter what.'' That would have been great to see. ''Me? No. This is just one I heard about. But it was their fault. What Brainiac thought. Ah yes Slipknot are playing across they way so close in fact they are in audio range. Lets set up a stage right next door.'' She looks a little incredulous. ''How else was that going to go?'' No such thing as bad press I guess, expect no press it turns out.

''Oh yeah its a degree up from regular bad sex. Because if they turn out to be boring.'' They usually did. ''You can ignore them and focus on the theme.'' Get creative.

Nodding with some enthusiasm. ''Yeah for sure.'' When was the last time I checked? ''There's no way that'll close any time soon.'' It's lasted decades at this point. ''It hits its demographic just to perfectly.'' In the best possible way.

[Helen Kingsley]

"Keith Richards wears it better. At least the way he looks, whether he's aging any more isn't that obvious and by now, he's one of the three things even some atomic holocaust couldn't kill. Allegedly, that is." Helen drinks a little from the bottle, thoughtful. "Said easy enough, but doing something about things ain't always as easy as it looks. You ain't got much of a perspective or future to work for, why try to get back up if the best it will earn you is another kick in the ribs to send you back down ? Some things out there you just can't do a whole of a lot about." Not that she endorses the mentality, but then, she's sure she doesn't come across like that anyway. "I've seen enough folks like that, discarded by a society that thinks it doesn't need them anymore, or never needed them in the first place." Looking back at Verity. "Sleepwalking through the American Dream. Or whatever dream their place has."

She thinks back a bit.

"So, once upon a time, back when they still allowed people like me into their country, we're sitting in this tent and have finally run out of things to do to kill time. So we get into that sort of discussion once again. We've had it countless times before and everyone knows how it's going to go, but unless something surprising happens, it's not like we have anything better to do. Any case, we have this guy. Pretty macho, as you'd call it. Almost nobody knew his real name, everyone called him Elvis. Because he liked the music, was a decent singer and pretty much considered himself human catnip for women. Heh, heh." She chuckles and sips some more beer. "Anyways, he 's gotten into this argument with some of the boys next door and they made a damn contest out of it. This guy is determined to prove he's the manliest guy in the place the only way he knows how. Guess what ? Didn't have anything to do with singing. So he's trying to find ten women willing to attest to his 'talents'. As in, he's gotta do ten in a row in one night. The full program. Oh, and there'd be no recordings, but some witnesses to make sure everything was legit.

Looking at the time and place, that sort of shit is pretty forbidden and if he's caught, things'll get ugly. As in ugly bad. But it's his reputatiuon on the line and he can't have that, so he's going for maximum overkill. Meaning folks have collected and several guys are willing to smuggle ten Fatimas through the wire, to make extra sure everyone caught red-handed goes to jail. Well, by that time all was arranged and I didn#t have any realistic way to intervene, so everyone involved being adults I did the only sensible thing. Which was being as far away from the place as humanly possible when everything went down. Which was pretty easy, I was scheduled outside anyway.

I get back after about a week, camp's abuzz. That crazy fucker did it. Not in, things took place and there was an issue or so, that guy really pulled it off. Heh." Helen makes a short pause before she continues. "Now you'll say, where's that twist of the knife that brings the guy around to where he doesn't get what he was after ? Well, part two starts two days later when guess-who turns up at the pit with his pants around his ankles. Turns out he's got testicles swollen to the size of ping-pong balls. Took three days until he could put on pants again. And with him being worried about if anything would stay behind on his functionality or the general pain... Let's say he lost everything he won that night in bribes to keep folks from discovering why he was really there and the way he went bitching about the pain and stuffs ? He could have built a solid rep on that feat, but after he got out again, he only got the rep as a big sissy. So yeah, he took that knife and twisted it himself and it was the biggest 100 to 0 I've ever seen so far."

"Noted, I'll be looking forward to hear from you, then." Helen ponders. "Nah, I've been busy with other things, I didn't have thjat much time for the non-formal stuff. Also, black's not my color and I'm a little too old for the sort of stuff most goth-clubs require. But I'll take your word for it, wouldn't have taken her for that type. Nice work, then, though.

"Yeah, somebody didn't think that through, I guess. Or just thought they could get rid of some merchandize with the lot of possibly slightly drunk people in the place. Well, sometimes people leave their brains at home when going to make the big decisions. Hope they fired their agent, if they had something like that." Focus on the theme, eh ? That's a whole bunch of stuff Helen doesn't really need context for, so she just nods. "Fair enough, but demographics are fickle things. But good to hear it hangs on. It's always good if good things stay around for a change."

[Verity Carmen]

Verity sniggers. ''He might survive the apocalypse but I'll take the pretty rocker girl that might be a replacement, or clone or whatever that internet story is.'' Helen has a point, there's is no denying that and Verity doesn't even try. ''Things can be pretty shit for sure.'' But that mentality she has and to her mind will never get onboard with. ''Because if you exist the only person who is going to truly and really care about making your lot better is you. Waiting for someone to step and solve your problems, wave a magic wand or just do what needs to done is how things are left to get worse.'' You try because you have to. ''If you want more out of existence then you have to pry it from those who don't want you to have it. Whatever form that takes for you.'' Some learn to play the game, others rebel, others fight. ''You are responsible for you.'' Pause. ''And for kicking back, literally or figuratively, at those who try to make things worse.'' Faded memories, enough to make her scowl, liked minded on the picket, at the march, fewer familiar faces every time.

Verity takes the time to listen, she is good at listening. Cooling the simmer that sparked within, taking the time to enjoy her drink nodding at the right moments. Until the tale is told. ''Sounds like you were in the Military.'' Or some kind of warped humanitarian aid camp. ''And the guy really banged ten total strangers in one night and was surprised he caught an STD.'' The musical tones of her laugh last longer then the usual polite span, she found it quite funny. What a moron. ''Still you think he learned his lesson?'' What lesson Verity thinks he should have learned is left unsaid.

Nodding while still getting the chuckles under control. ''She certainty caught me off guard that was for sure.''

She shrugs. ''True enough. Helps not many places are like or have its reputation.'' It has that right spirt no doubt about it, a relic of an era past that refused to acknowledge the last call bell.

[Helen Kingsley]

"Fair enough." 'Pretty shit' the understatement of the year, though. "Things have that habit of getting worse. Getting better, now that's harder." Helen gives Verity another look. "Now, I ain't saying some of that wolves and sheep shit that's so damn popular today with the kids who think they're big and tough and different from the rest although they ain't, they just don't know it yet. 'Do what needs to be done' is a pretty subjective thing. In the end, it comes down to one central and pretty universal thing. You got it, everything's possible. You don't, you're shit out of luck. Me, you and other folks like us ? We got it, if we didn't, we wouldn't be here. Problem with that particular sort of Flavor-Aid is, that shit becomes so internalized, it's easy to forget there's people who don't have it and then wondering why that is. But these folks exist after all."

She smirks and drinks some beer.

"You wanna riddle me what that thing I'm talking about is ?" Helen wags her finger playfully. "No STD, a bad sort of inflammation is all, but he could have come down with way worse stuff, that much is true. Those girls weren't really known for their sanitary habits, heh." She chuckles. "It does, doesn't it ? Let's say you either took a few notes from their book or you got the Kirkland brand holiday experience."

Asked if she thinks the guy learned his lesson, Helen makes a contemptuous face. "Psh, that would have been the first lesson that dumb son of a bitch ever learned in his damn life. Last time I heard, he was on wife four. Should be six by now if he's kept it steady."

"I can believe that. She's got her way with that kind of stuff." She nods to make a point. "As long as the concept works, why not. When they feel they have to change things up is when it gets interesting."

[Verity Carmen]

A light grimace crosses her face as she clearly has other thoughts on the natter. ''Things have a habit of changing.'' Takes a slow drink. ''The better or worse is based on does the changing and how you react to it.'' But it is usually viewed negatively. She does however concede the point about subjectivism, sort of. ''Yeah no that's fair different people want to see different things happen.'' But that means little and less at the end of the day. ''But waiting for someone else to do whatever it is rather then trying yourself to improve your lot is still the same all around, whoever does the waiting, for whatever it is.'' It's a desperate person who blames luck.

A smirk and side eye are given then. Like me and you? Tactful but not true is it. ''You for instance. You weren't just handed what you have now. Responsibility that is. The power to actually have a say in things.'' Some assumptions being made here by the Daeva. ''I bet you worked your ass off and showed why you would best fit for the job.'' Speaking of internalised moxie, now me on the other. ''While I. I could not survive a nasty hit to my reputation or standing. I don't have the history of earning it.'' But if you sit on your laurels for any reason things begin to change, you lose what you had.

Turning she looks a little confused. Not much gets by her but this seems to have. ''Riddle you what exactly?'' Her job? where she was? Shaking it off. Confusion is replaced by a look of impish mischief. ''He didn't? Now that's a shame.'' And she means it. ''I got no problems with adults consenting to whatever in the bedroom but a good bout of hubris is always funny.'' And this sounded sketchy at best, smuggling women does not scream above board to me. ''Good grief.'' A note of exasperated in the musical tones, she drinks. ''Well if he is going to be dumb at least he seems to have something else going for him.'' To everyone else's misfortune it seems.

That's a grim thought. ''Point taken, new management rarely knows how to handle what they get. Change things up to make their mark and all.'' I hope someone competent picks it up when the time comes. ''Then down the drain.'' She sighs. ''That'll be a sad day.'' Turning the question. ''You got a place like that? Somewhere you'll be sorry to see go?''

[Helen Kingsley]

"That's for sure." Helen agrees. "Still, I think we're mostly agreeing, yet wqhenever I bring up that there's people who don't have a lot of options there, we're back at the lazy folks who wait for someone else to solve their problems, when I'm talking about the people that have given up or don't see the point. It ain't the same thing." Sounds a little like somebody has an axe to grind there... "I was also kind of the only one who sort of wanted the job. I figure that also helped. Numbers are down a little, after all."

Helen chuckles.

"Riddle me what can change someone who's abandoned all hope for good into someone who's willing to push back or push back again. In your opinion, what's the best thing that can come to these guys to motivate them ? What can change the nature of a man that much ?"

"I know, right ?" talking about the hubris. "Well, so rumor said. I don't know, obviously. And I didn't really want to anyway."

"Yeah, making your mark while keeping the good stuff good is harder than most people think. Still, in the end, everything heads for the drain eventually. Circle of life and all that Elton John shit." Shjer ponders for a bit, interrupted by some beer to keep the thinking straight. "There's some, but most of those are gone by now, others... Dunno. I'm not in the business of staying too attached. They made a parking lot out of the first place I lived at when I started college. After that, I kind of stopped keeping tabs on those things. Chance is, I like what they used to be better than what they are today, if they're still around."

[Verity Carmen]

Verity turns back to looking down from the balcony. ''If someone has given up then whatever happens happens and they gave up the right to complain or be angry about it.'' Very dismissive. ''If their position is just heads down and get on with the day to day that's their way. That's fair enough. That's not what I've been going on about.'' We're back to it because I think we're talking about different groups. ''I'm talking about the whiners and moaners who cry its not fair, or the systems broken but won't even sign a petition to try and change it or better their lot.'' The truly broken do exist but so do these morons. ''I'm talking about the lazy and entitled.'' So to turn this. ''But it's something I struggle with that. The idea that there is no point, or giving up.'' Never been something I'm good at. ''I've always struggled to see why people do it.'' A hint of venom in her tone. ''Because it does seem everyone does in the end.'' Take a final bow and leave the stage.

She doesn't turn as continues. ''Even so if I don't think she.'' Expecting Helen to know to whom she referred. ''Would have given you something she didn't think you had earned.'' Seems to be a big believer of proof being in the doing from what chats we've had.

A frustrated shrug. ''If I knew that maybe things would have turned out very differently for me.'' Not that I'm complaining how things turned out. She does seem to mellow into that idea. ''I got what I wanted with a little extra of course.'' And now me I can motivate people to do that if I wanted to. ''But if someone can be broken they can be rebuilt.'' Not fixed. ''But in total honest truth.'' That was easier then you'd think. ''The same thing that's motivated people since the dawn of civilisation.'' Turning to look the at haunt once more. ''Leadership. Great leadership. The right person taking the reigns.'' She finishes her beer to let the point sit. ''Can you name one movement or organisation that didn't find success because of the figure head or person in charge?'' I can't.

She does find her way to a wry grin finding some enjoyment in the universally force of hubris, ready to strike down idiots dumb enough to test it.

''Now isn't that the truth.'' Said one eternal to another. ''Until then hakuna matata, hey.'' Keeping on Lion king if not Elton himself. ''Don't we all see the past with rose tinted glasses.'' But it makes sense. ''Still why dwell on the old when there's so much new stuff constantly happening.'' Because most of it fails to compare. ''It is sound reasoning though why mess with the stuff that's part of you by mixing up with worse experiences.'' Very much still believing the faded memories, stunted feelings and general disconnect from humanity still constituted the people they once were.

[Helen Kingsley]

"Eh, bitching about things you can't change helps with mental health. There's enough people where you have to worry once they stop doing that. Also, let's be real, when it comes to the important stuff, petitions don't do shit and putting your signature under one does little except tell folks you might not want to know you're against stuffs that you're against stuffs." Helen shrugs.

"Yah, those are annoying. Me, I've never seen the charm of that sort of thinking, but you know what they say about good people ? Good people know their limits. Its almost funny, seeing all those kids running around thinking if they just work their ass off and have a bit of luck, things will turn out their way and sky's the limit. It don't work that way, but they crash and burn learning that the old-fashioned way. A cultural thing, too, I guess. I've worked with people from formerly communist countries for a while and let me tell you, those had a bunch of pretty fatalistic guys among them. Ah, man, look at me preach." She chuckles and finishes her beer.

"Ain't that the truth. You certainly can, but only if it works. If it doesn't, things get nasty quick. What's your experience with that line of work ?"

"Interesting point from someone of your description, ain't it ?" She listens and ponders verity's reply. Not exactly the direction she'd aimed in, but fair enough. That also tells a few things, so she rolls with it. "So doesn't that mean the endgame is either to become that leader or find one of those and then jump on the bandwagon ? I mean, thats all extrinsic motivation. What about intrinsic ?" She thinks for a moment. "Depends on what you see as success. Are we talking thing that went Dodo despite having a great leader at the helm ? I mean, let's be real, great leader is a pretty posthumous certificate, if a guy fails, he simply doesn't get it because if it ain't all sunshine and rainbows, apparently that guy wasn't so great after all. Or a downright scumbucket. I'd throw the hat of the USSR into the ring, though."

She shrugs.

"Bias, I guess. Better the things you know than newer or older stuff. I mean, the looks I get when I tell folks all of their online shit didn't exist when I was a kid are enough. Or when they barely know what, say..." She takes a bit to find something fitting "...girl scouts are. Heh heh."

[Verity Carmen]

That changes her tone, from frustration to a smile. See you do get it. ''I'd much prefer that. It's way more interesting to see what people try once they get past grumbling.'' Better that then the languid well of apathy. Her next comment is matched by a playful smirk. ''Come on you know I was facetious. Of course petitions do sweet f a. But its symbolic of someone not willing to lift a finger even in show.'' If that method worked I'd still be holding placards and sign up sheets.

Verity snorts, a spray of beer goes with it over the edge of the balcony. ''What makes a person, a good person?'' No seriously. ''Because I've never met one who thinks of themselves as evil.'' No matter who much I might disagree. ''Its the great, for good or ill, even if they know there limits but decided not to be held back by them, the real aim for the stars sorts.'' Not the sky. '' The ones who say watch me to those who say impossible.'' The history makers. ''There's nothing wrong with knowing how to play the game. And no one starts of with an instruction manual. This lot.'' She is careful not to say my. ''Are what you get when you raise a generation on the idea that everyone matters, that all you need is to want it. It takes some longer then others to realise what the actual rules are of all this.'' Eyes play over the various kine by the bar now, the ones they share space with. ''But plenty of interesting people do exist.'' And they've usually worked harder then most others.

My experience? ''Of rebuilding a person?'' To my design or agenda. ''Now that would be telling.'' Helen I'm more addictive then any drug ever synthesized, I can make an idol of myself in moments. Have a cult following in minutes. She caves in the fullness of her own ego. ''If Greed, Politics and religion rolled into one amorphous mass of motivation.'' So you know life. ''I could pry people out of its clutches if I was of the mind.'' And have then lay it at my alter.

She cocks and eyebrow looking over. ''My description?'' Oh so that's how it is hm. ''Don't get me wrong I know what I look like and I know how to use it.'' And its enough for many. ''But that, is as you say extrinsic.'' Fair turn around. ''No what I speak of in leadership is not a king or president not some figure head. The kind of person who brings followers to them just by being, the kind that makes you want to follow without being told or asked. The ones who with a conversation can redefine ideology. Make others not just accept but whole heartedly believe and live for it.'' Jesus, Abe Lincoln so on so forth. ''The kind of person who can change you inside fundamentally seemingly without effort.'' Rare as those are.

''All movements end eventually. No matter how great a start they had, or how bright they burned. We have a few long standing ones still around sure but if you class something as ineffective just because it crumbled after a while I think your missing the point. If it couldn't survive without its leader then we know what held it together.'' She nods. ''Some great leaders are truly horrid people. I won't contest you on that. And yes greatness is more a measure of life lived then life living. Doesn't change my point though.'' Shame I don't know much about the USSR, might have been able to turn it if I did.

''Stop it.'' Verity looks serious for a moment before cracking up slightly. ''Your making me feel old.'' She lounges against the railing. ''I can remember when tech was not in every home or hand or pocket.'' Particularly if you were poor. ''To think how far its come in jus ta few decades.'' But we all adapt. ''Wait what. How can someone not know hat girl scouts are?'' Now that's just intentional ignorance.