Dice - Surprise , Initiative , Social

[West]

Assumed she would get a suprise round.

There's a few misconceptions about Surprise in the nWoD.

Surprise, as defined by nWoD, is covered in WoD p.151-152 and consists of two elements:
a) architecting a scenario where the other party is unaware
b) the other party failing their PERception roll

Even if Surprise is accomplished, it simply negates their DEFense.

There are no bonus/extra Surprise Turns.

To clarify the system vs. perception, a 'surprise attack' is simply winning Initiative. It means you went before they did. It's not unreasonable to suggest Initiative Modifiers if you feel like you've 'lulled' a target into complacency; often I'll just let a player have it. I justify this with the "Initiative re-ordering" Action.

So, always roll Init. Some people have noticed in the past I havne't bothered to roll and just let them go first -- this is when I've determined they've 'gotten the drop'.

Another note is I'm also a fan of called shots/effects. Feel free to describe such, and I'll narrate whether it was successful. Most of the time it will involve over-suxxing an Attribute (STA for KO, DEX for Disarm, etc), but it will always involve a to-hit Penalty, unless an appropriate FS Maneuver or Merit is possessed.

[West]

So the subject came up of throwing social dice...

Go for it.

I'm a firm believer that players who paid for social stuff should get to use it just like people who pay for combat stuff.

Here's how we're going to use it, and this is open for re-evaluation;

The aggressor rolls, the defender rolls.

If:
The aggressor wins with the most successes (but not an e-success) they achieve the desired effect and the defender is free to fully role-play/interpret the reaction.

The aggressor wins with an exceptional success -or- gets twice as many successes as the defender's primary Resistance Attribute, I will interpret the effect. Examples are, having to flee the room, rolling for Frenzy, etc.

The defender wins with the most successes (but not an e-success) they understand what they aggressor is trying to do, but are unaffected.

The defender wins with an exceptional success -or- gets twice as many successes as the aggressor's Attribute, they gain an additional +1 modifier to every roll thereafter in the Scene that involves the aggressor.

I think that's it; we'll see how it goes.

Please note that in keeping with the no non-consensual rule, Seduction rolls may be interpreted differently but only if the e-suxx occurred on the first roll and the defender did not have an opportunity to break the Scene. If the defender chooses to remain in the scenario after the first roll, then that is no longer considered non-consensual.

[West]

P.S. this is only for VtR; please consult your local ST for how they choose to resolve such rolls.

[West]

This came up, and I thought I'd clarify how I run it, and what people should expect. It seems there is a fairly common interpretation of mental/psychic powers being used without rolling Initiative.

First, let me say I'm not calling that method wrong, but it's not the one I use.

Mechanically, it's my interpretation that:
1) Ambushes are accounted for by the Surprise rule. In powers, perhaps that means the defender notices a bit of body language, or look of concentration, or some such.
2) Powers are defined as Actions, and Actions are resolved using Turns if Actions oppose. Turns are sequenced by Initiative.

Obviously the question is:
But how does Joe know I'm going to Dominate him?

He doesn't. However, he may notice the attacker starting to stare at him, or a muscle tic or any of a number of things that would indicate something is amiss. Within milliseconds, Joe begins to respond, and if he is quicker (wins Initiative) he can act before the attacker locks eyes.

Thematically, as a Storyteller, and player, I don't like encouraging/playing to preemption. When a system encourages hitting first (by granting surprise/awarding Initiative/etc) the risk of attack is greatly reduced. Then suddenly everyone is building 'hit first' toons and we're letting the system dictate how we approach conflict resolution.

For Sorcerers, enacting your Rituals begin your Actions. With the nature of the Ritual being Extended, the only chance of failure is having the ritual stopped.

But, West, how did Joe know that standing on one foot was part of my Ritual? He's not in my Covenant! He doesn't know!

My answer to that is that people aren't stupid. Just like Kindred know that the Dragons have ways to mitigate the curses, they know that Sorceries exist. They may not know the particulars, but you can't expect strange behavior to go unnoticed. No one is going to stand by idly while you assemble a zip gun, even if they don't know what the end product will look like.

Feel free to ask questions for clarification!

[West]

Let me clarify the last point: that is the 'norm'. If the defender's character doesn't have any 'common' knowledge, then they won't get that benefit of the doubt. Examples would include 'new' Embraces or zero Occult.